>2 euro?? No wonder he puts those requesters like that....

Like i said, if he wants people to pay, just say so.

In the online registration he asks for > 0Euro, and
2 euro is more than that.

[ Edited by catohagen on 2005/12/28 4:12 ]

Quote:

I think your sense of causality is mixed up, Magnetic. Cause comes *before* effect. The requesters were already there.

Chris has put himself into a position where he can't fail to be disappointed. If he asks a shareware fee, he won't get a lot of them. If he asks for a donation >0 Euro, he can't really be surprised at 1 euro donations. The sheer irration factor of the requester scheme means people will get frustrated, and as they get frustrated, as we see, they'll find ways around it and Chris will get frustrated too. It's the tragic cycle that forced many of our most gifted shareware authors out of the Amiga market.

My advice to Chris? - to make up his mind. If he doesn't want to charge shareware fees, then he should specify a sensible minimum donation level. The way it looks now is that he's trying to get himself disappointed. If he finds a reason to stop supporting MorphOS, I'd rather it was a good one rather than bitterness caused by trivial stuff.

>I tried donating 1eur, but it was rejected...

I do not understand this.
In http://groups.yahoo.com/group/highway_usb/message/1886 we can read:

"MorphOS users may donate any sum of money depending on what they think is reasonable.
In return, they will get a keyfile that works nicely on their Pegasos or MorphOS PowerUp."

I thought about donating 2 cents to see if he is for real and then giving him a nice present later...
Chris, did you really reject the registration fee or was it just an error?

Tarbos

Platon obviously is a MOS Enthuisist himself and is sympathetic to the community - hence the low reg fee. I'm sure he honours his word and if you donate Anything he will send the keyfile... though its a slap in the face to donate 10 cents or so imho..

but of course this was before the thread got crazy, now i'm sure he is pissed off and who knows whats going to happen now.

magnetic

>>I tried donating 1eur, but it was rejected...

>I do not understand this.

Maybe Mr. catohagen tried to pay via PayPal and credit card. Chris wrote in the Poseidon V3 docs that that kind of payment will be rejected. If you want to pay via PayPal you first have to pay the amount due into your PayPal account and then transfer the money.

@catohagen:

Simply move the first remind requesters outta ya screen and forget about it. Then you will only be reminded one single time after "10" minutes after a reboot. Really no reason to tell such stupid things like you did, eh?

alright guys, the hacker-padawan has done his mea culpa, now we should better move on.

I have to admit that i used this hack myself before i realised how good was Poseidon and how useful it can be. This is a must-have and i'll get my donation ready asap (xmas bankrupted me..).

Argh! The PoPo-requester hangs and starts sucking 100% CPU if it's left alone for a while (at least it does on my system). This is the third time it happens. I think I'll revert to the old version.

> Did you remove the "elbox" USB keyboard typing restrictions for v3.x which I requested one year ago?

Yes, and "Elbox-feature-less" versions were available ever since.

> Btw - Happy birthday!

Thanks.

> every 10
fuc*king minute

Every 15 minutes.

> I tried donating 1eur, but it was rejected....and i did it because i felt forced.

Mr. Cato Hagen, do you have some agenda to promote, or why don't you tell people why this donation was rejected?

It was not rejected for the amount (even somebody who transferred 0,92 EUR will be getting his keyfile), but for the reason that you are (sorry to say) just too stupid to read and understand the DOZENS of warnings about PayPal CREDIT CARD payments. Hey, I even added an additional requester in Trident to make this clear. But no, some of the users are just too <whatever> to grasp this. The next version will have PayPal payment disabled for italian and french users. I'm fed up with being blaimed for rejecting payments as used here to put up a mob against me.

Come on, there is not even an option to "reject" PayPal payments other than for a base account and credit card payments.

Simple as this: Don't use my software, if you're not accepting the conditions (and after all these postings by you, I would beg you not to).

> Argh! The PoPo-requester hangs and starts sucking 100% CPU if it's left alone for a while (at least it does on my system). This is the third time it happens. I think I'll revert to the old version.

Do whatever you want. The fact is, that this "PoPo-Requester" (if you're talking about the nag requester) is a standard MUI_Request call without any further system interaction. There is no obvious reason why the requester would take up 100% cpu time, other than MUI being broken

Quote:

Well, then it is really strange, because I've never encountered this problem in any other MUI-application before. Not only does it take 100% CPU, but it eats up *ALL* the ram too. Maybe it won't crash if I don't keep the PoPo-window iconified.

Cheers

Quote:
It's not like if we had the choice.

You're program is an important part of the system, and you know that.

Of course, we could fall back to Poseidon 2.x, but your new verion adds some important features: you know that as well...

I really don't see where the choice is. Either you want to get the most out of MorphOS, and you'll go for Poseidon3 (and will have to pay because of this requester...), either you don't bother and will stay with v2.

What I don't get is why people are still trying to ask money where there's no market.

Because of the time you spend on it ?

Well, a lot of other developers are spending a lot of their free time to work on MorphOS stuff and don't necessary feel forced to ask money for it.

I also spent a lot of time working on MorphOS stuff. But I don't have your skill and only released a few ports (or even simple recompilations): maybe I would feel the need to ask for money as well if I could release some piece of software as good as yours. Who knows ?

As for French&Italian people: you get pissed off because people are reporting they cannot send you some money ?!

I must have missed something here...

A lot of French people have bad English knowledge, just saw a Paypal button and tried to send money... They're surprised when their money appear to be refused. That's simply it. There's really no bad intention at all.

Leo.

> What I don't get is why people are still trying to ask money where there's no market.

There are thousands of active Amiga classic and MorphOS users around and that is the target of Poseidon. So if 1000 people pay 10 euro it makes 10.000 euro and I would call it a market. You could anser it will never happen, but that is simply bad.

> I also spent a lot of time working on MorphOS stuff.

That's OK, but that is not a rule. It is up to the one who made the program to decide if she/he wants to be paid or not. It doesn't not even depends on the program in itself, otherwise Linus should be paid billion of euro, and Firefox team as well. It is just a personal decision, you can't judge at all. Being Poseidon part of the os means nothing here as well. There are other os (look at macosx) where you pay for update as well. Also MorphOS is not financed anymore.

Working for free is good, asking to be paid for our work is as good as. I should like to see you asking your hydraulic (english?) not to be paid.

You can just judge the way he choosed to protect his software, that may be described as a little bit annoying.

>> every 10 fuc*king minute

>Every 15 minutes.

nitpick :)


>Mr. Cato Hagen, do you have some agenda to promote,
>or why don't you tell people why this donation was rejected?

Why on earth should i have an agenda against you ?
I didnt know the reason, i just got an email 'Payment rejected'

>It was not rejected for the amount
>(even somebody who transferred 0,92 EUR will be getting his keyfile), but for the
>reason that you are (sorry to say) just too stupid to read and understand the
>DOZENS of warnings about PayPal CREDIT CARD payments.

sorry for being stupid.

I logged into paypal and sent the euro, and they took the euro from my account.
This is how i have done houndreds of payments for buying misc software,
Renoise(music tracker), Xchat irc program, Morphos Bounty donations, AmiNetRadio
donation to #amigazeux, etc...

What else is there to do ? isnt this how paypal works ?

If i had no money on my bank account, paypal wouldnt have allowed the payment.

Couldn't you have waited until you saw the euro in your account before sending the
keyfile ?

> Hey, I even added an additional
>requester in Trident to make this clear. But no, some of the users are just too
><whatever> to grasp this. The next version will have PayPal payment disabled for
>italian and french users.

Im norwegian

>I'm fed up with being blaimed for rejecting payments as used here to put up a mob
>against me.
>Come on, there is not even an option to "reject" PayPal payments other than for a base
>account and credit card payments.
>Simple as this: Don't use my software, if you're not accepting the conditions
(and after all these postings by you, I would beg you not to).

What postings ? This is my second post in this thread.

So you dont want my money for the keyfile ? I dont get it...

>>The next version will have PayPal payment disabled for italian and french users. I'm fed up with being blaimed for rejecting payments as used here to put up a mob against me.


LOL paypal work fine with me(i have not donate to poseidon because i use the old version )
but don't close the paypal option for italian or french user pls

Alfie

Good post. 4gr33d. This whole "other mos developers work for free" is rubbish. That is their choice as its a hobby for them and they may have other sources of income. I think with Platon its his source of income and he has every right to charge whatever he feels necessary. I mean we should all be thanking him for supporting Ami/MOS not scaring him away with crazy public posts.


magnetic

ps.. the other mos devs dont need money as they are either filthy rich and have 5 bmws or they live at home with their parents and play video games all day and dont need money!

@catohagen:

The reason why Chris does reject credit card payments is simple: for every payment he receives by dudes debiting their credit cards he has to pay a fee to PayPal. But if someone _first_ debits his credit card or whatever to get money onto his PayPal account and _then_ transfers the money to Chris there will be no (or at least a dramatically reduced) fee on receipt.

It is really that simple

If he would think like that stuff you wrote (that people paying by credit card are bad guys who want to do credit card fraud) he would be kinda stupid because he knows that everyone who pay via PayPal - no matter in which way - could claim to PayPal that he never got the goods he payed for, which would cause at least problems for Chris.

Quote:
I've heard that rumor!

Depending on Platon42's account with PayPal, his fee could very well be greater for a credit card through them than with a regular PayPal payment. However, that is strictly dependant on the kind of PayPal account he may have (likely a merchant account). I know with me, the fee is the same either way (Premier account). He could be making a stand against using credit cards over the internet in the face of all the abuse users can find themselves in.

Also, I do not think it's necissarily greed about wanting to take a donation based on hours of work. If you look at the registration tool, you'll notice that you don't have to donate the "suggested amount." Maybe Platon42 can come on and clarify the "suggested donation" bit.

Quote:
I said other mos developers don't feel the need to ask money...

As for platon living with Poseidon licences, I think you're wrong: he clearly said the money he asked was only a symbol. (And what a symbol: "I sent 1Euro because I was fed up with this requester showing every 15 minutes !" - Now that's a symbol !!)

Btw you cannot live with the Amiga. Even if *every* active Amiga user was buying your software...

Leo.

I really have to shake my head on what you are discussing here. A new software version has been published with great new functionalities and the producer tells you about the licensing terms. You as a user have exactly two choices: either you agree to the terms and conditions, fulfill them and use the new possibilities or you accept the terms, don't agree and are satisfied with the old version. The terms are simply up to the author.

Now please ask yourself how high this threshold is to agree to these terms here and give the author this little refund that he asks for. Pay him 1 single Euro if you cannot overcome your inhibitions to give him some more for his great work that you want to use. 1 Euro - have you ever got any software of this functionality that you payed nearly nothing for? If you don't want to support Amiga developers then please go away and do not use Amiga related things anymore. Amiga isn't made for you. You did not understand why we are still here. Go ahead for linux exclusively and be happy with that but do not complain about authors that invest a lot of time and try to improve _your_ software situation.

See this software as a gift to you because that's what it is in my sight: the best USB stack that is available on any platform. Remember Windows popping up 3 or 4 messages whenever you insert a thumb drive, taking 20 to 30 seconds at best until you can use it if it not even needs to install software first? How many developers are there at Microsoft that have to answer for it? Here is just one single person that shows them how it is done. And you are arguing about paying a symbolic fee to get rid of just one of those requesters and show the author at least a small "thank you" for one of the best programs that ever have reached the Amiga universe. Shame on you.

@Sprocki

Very well said!

And regarding the PayPal fees: At least in Germany, once you'd want to accept a credit card payment, you would have to turn your account from a base one into a premium/business one. But after doing so, you'd have to pay a fee on receiving non-credit card payments as well, afterwards, which have been free before with the base account.

@ Sprocki

Very well put!

I feel kind of sick that this whole discussion is even taking place. Hodges terms are very fair and generous IMHO, his software is simply *great* and very much essential to the platform. If you don't like the terms, and if you don't want to show any kind of appreciation, then don't use it, piss off, and do it quietly.

Keep it up Hodges!

I only to say one thing : "Thank you Platon !"

And for the others users, launch Trident today !

yeah! nice Happy New Year gift, Chris! Thanks (i'm not a Poseidon user . . tryed only to run Trident)