Cloanto sues Hyperion
  • Order of the Butterfly
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    number6
    Posts: 456 from 2008/8/10
    Quote:

    rob wrote:
    Quote:

    redrumloa wrote:
    Quote:

    rob wrote:
    by the 2009 settlement agreement which is still active.



    Hyperion repeatedly violated this settlement agreement, which is easily demonstrable. You may disagree based on your feelings, but i believe Cloanto will easily win their lawsuit.


    My point is that regardless of how this case concludes, Cloanto are still bound by the settlement agreement while the case is ongoing.

    FYI Cloanto winning would probably be the best outcome here in my "emotionally charged" opinion.


    I believe you bring up an excellent point by mentioning emotion.
    It is extremely challenging to be neutral, given the personal side of this...how people believe they have been wronged out of spite, cheated, ignored, etc.
    If you just look at english amiga board, A1k, a.org...it is evident that when 3.1.4 became available, the majority of people were just pleased to have something. Politics in the threads? Sure a bit, but the thrust was mostly exchange of reports and some thanks given.

    Since the real issue is about ability to deliver product based on factors ranging from funding to manpower to management skills to..well you get the idea.
    We have much information grounded in fact concerning Hyperion's financial issues, along with frankly honest admittances over the years that there simply is no money. It is fair to say debt outweighs any perceived source of income, imo.
    Therefore, if there is any "rooting" to go on, I think people might wish to consider who has the most likely opportunity to deliver product, given all the factors involved in achieving that goal.

    #6
  • »22.02.19 - 12:07
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
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    KennyR
    Posts: 787 from 2003/3/4
    From: #AmigaZeux, Gu...
    Or to summarise: regardless of like or dislike of Hyperion, or what products they release, every cent anyone puts into them will be wasted.

    Any product they make will be abandoned for lack of money. Any partnerships will turn sour. They're in too much debt and fighting too many battles they can't win. People badly wanted 3.1.4, yet now it is all but dead and the money it made probably squandered already.

    Hyperion should have folded a decade ago. Good money after bad, catching a falling knife, etc etc.
  • »22.02.19 - 12:43
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Why did Hyperion just days ago file an appeal to overturn their
    > refused opposition to the EUIPO filing for the Amiga trademark
    > by "Drews, Heinz-Alexander", especially given that Amiga Inc.
    > registered the tm and now has apparently transferred same to Cloanto?

    While I can't answer this question, I see Mr. Drews being mentioned by Hyperion director Costel "Cyborg" Mincea (Google translation):

    "you know very well, to whom it is due, that for some time not really what is going on OS4. Battilana, Dickinson, Leaman or even your dear Alexander Drews constantly force us to take care of their nonsense instead of focusing on AmigaOS."
    http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=https://www.os4welt.de/viewtopic.php?p=35427%23p35427

    Btw, isn't Dickinson a Hyperion shareholder and creditor?
  • »22.02.19 - 14:08
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    number6
    Posts: 456 from 2008/8/10
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > Why did Hyperion just days ago file an appeal to overturn their
    > refused opposition to the EUIPO filing for the Amiga trademark
    > by "Drews, Heinz-Alexander", especially given that Amiga Inc.
    > registered the tm and now has apparently transferred same to Cloanto?

    While I can't answer this question, I see Mr. Drews being mentioned by Hyperion director Costel "Cyborg" Mincea (Google translation):

    "you know very well, to whom it is due, that for some time not really what is going on OS4. Battilana, Dickinson, Leaman or even your dear Alexander Drews constantly force us to take care of their nonsense instead of focusing on AmigaOS."
    http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=https://www.os4welt.de/viewtopic.php?p=35427%23p35427

    Btw, isn't Dickinson a Hyperion shareholder and creditor?


    Thanks for the link. Silly me. I did not read that thread prior at all.
    I think anyone who thought AF was firmly slanted should read the entire thread and gain some enlightenment.

    I think I mentioned before? Information about the shareholder situation might well only exist in a discovery document atm. Certainly there have been enough postings by the public to lead one to believe Trevor is a creditor, but I'm uncertain whether that is really public either. Sorry.

    #6
  • »22.02.19 - 14:45
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    amigadave
    Posts: 2790 from 2006/3/21
    From: Northern Calif...
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > Why did Hyperion just days ago file an appeal to overturn their
    > refused opposition to the EUIPO filing for the Amiga trademark
    > by "Drews, Heinz-Alexander", especially given that Amiga Inc.
    > registered the tm and now has apparently transferred same to Cloanto?

    While I can't answer this question, I see Mr. Drews being mentioned by Hyperion director Costel "Cyborg" Mincea (Google translation):

    "you know very well, to whom it is due, that for some time not really what is going on OS4. Battilana, Dickinson, Leaman or even your dear Alexander Drews constantly force us to take care of their nonsense instead of focusing on AmigaOS."
    http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=https://www.os4welt.de/viewtopic.php?p=35427%23p35427

    Btw, isn't Dickinson a Hyperion shareholder and creditor?


    My guess Dickinson is a creditor, but I doubt he is still any kind of shareholder, unless he received shares in lieu of some money he was owed in some past transaction. When Trevor and Hyperion dissolved their partnership based in Belgium, and Trevor moved shop to the UK way back when the X1000 was being developed, or perhaps when it was having AmigaOS4 ported to it. I don't bother to keep such dates memorized, and for this discussion, I doubt the exact date is important.

    As for the statement by Costel Mincea quoted above, it appears that poor Hyperion (or at least Costel) feels that they are being attacked by the whole world, or at least the whole Amiga universe. It rarely comes true that such "victims" are found to be "in the right", and that the whole army of people acting against them is "in the wrong". Then again, maybe it is just a misconception by Costel, feeling that way. Personally, I would like to see Hyperion fail and have AmigaOS free of their inept control and legal intangelments, but that is a difficult dream to have materialize It is hard for me to imagine any other entity doing much worse at developing AmigaOS4, except perhaps Bill McEwen.
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »22.02.19 - 17:48
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> isn't Dickinson a Hyperion shareholder and creditor?

    > I doubt he is still any kind of shareholder

    "Still" meaning he once was (or may have been) a Hyperion shareholder but by now no longer is?

    > When Trevor and Hyperion dissolved their partnership based in Belgium

    A-Eon CVBA was co-owned by Ben Hermans but it had nothing to do with Hyperion.

    > and Trevor moved shop to the UK way back when the X1000 was being
    > developed, or perhaps when it was having AmigaOS4 ported to it.

    A-Eon Ltd. was founded only after the consumer release of the X1000, which was handled by A-Eon CVBA.
  • »22.02.19 - 19:14
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    amigadave
    Posts: 2790 from 2006/3/21
    From: Northern Calif...
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    >> isn't Dickinson a Hyperion shareholder and creditor?

    > I doubt he is still any kind of shareholder

    "Still" meaning he once was (or may have been) a Hyperion shareholder but by now no longer is?

    > When Trevor and Hyperion dissolved their partnership based in Belgium

    A-Eon CVBA was co-owned by Ben Hermans but it had nothing to do with Hyperion.

    > and Trevor moved shop to the UK way back when the X1000 was being
    > developed, or perhaps when it was having AmigaOS4 ported to it.

    A-Eon Ltd. was founded only after the consumer release of the X1000, which was handled by A-Eon CVBA.


    You are right, Trevor's shares in his partnership with Ben Hermans, or Hyperion, for the first incarnation of A-Eon, have nothing to do with Hyperion shares. I guess my meaning was that Trevor probably has no financial stake in any Hyperion shares, since his break with Hermans and the dissolution of A-Eon CVBA, unless he was granted shares of Hyperion Entertainment in return for part of his substantial investment in the original A-Eon CVBA, to compensate him for granting Ben Hermans, or Hyperion Entertainment a larger percentage of ownership in A-Eon CVBA. I hope that makes more sense.

    I don't believe that Hermans had any cash to invest as part of his partial ownership in the first A-Eon company. What else could he offer, besides shares of Hyperion Entertainment, with an imaginary value?
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »22.02.19 - 19:49
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  • Order of the Butterfly
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    number6
    Posts: 456 from 2008/8/10
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    >> isn't Dickinson a Hyperion shareholder and creditor?

    > I doubt he is still any kind of shareholder

    "Still" meaning he once was (or may have been) a Hyperion shareholder but by now no longer is?

    > When Trevor and Hyperion dissolved their partnership based in Belgium

    A-Eon CVBA was co-owned by Ben Hermans but it had nothing to do with Hyperion.

    > and Trevor moved shop to the UK way back when the X1000 was being
    > developed, or perhaps when it was having AmigaOS4 ported to it.

    A-Eon Ltd. was founded only after the consumer release of the X1000, which was handled by A-Eon CVBA.


    I don't know if you've followed the 3 part article on the X1000 in Amiga Future written from Trevor's perspective. But part 3, stated to have newish information on this history is due out in short order.

    btw-you don't happen to have the date when Evert posted and the Dutch docs about the change at A-eon appeared on moobunny, do you?

    #6
  • »22.02.19 - 20:00
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>> When Trevor and Hyperion dissolved their partnership based in Belgium

    >> A-Eon CVBA was co-owned by Ben Hermans but it had nothing to do with Hyperion.

    > You are right, Trevor's shares in his partnership with Ben Hermans, or Hyperion,
    > for the first incarnation of A-Eon, have nothing to do with Hyperion shares.

    What I meant is that in order to form A-Eon CVBA, Trevor entered into a partnership with Ben Hermans, but did not need to enter into a partnership with Hyperion. So even if Trevor became shareholder of Hyperion back then, this wasn't required to form A-Eon CVBA with Ben Hermans.

    > Trevor probably has no financial stake in any Hyperion shares

    This is what Trevor wrote in August 2017:

    "I made a quick trip to Brussels to attend the Hyperion Entertainment Shareholder's AGM. [...] we [...] were later joined by fellow Hyperion shareholder Ben Hermans"
    http://blog.a-eon.biz/blog/?p=10322

    Whether or not Trevor attending a Hyperion shareholder meeting in June 2017 would indicate him being a Hyperion shareholder in 2017 I don't know.

    > granting Ben Hermans, or Hyperion Entertainment a larger percentage of ownership
    > in A-Eon CVBA.

    As said, Hyperion was not a co-owner of A-Eon CVBA, but Ben Hermans was.

    > I don't believe that Hermans had any cash to invest as part of his partial
    > ownership in the first A-Eon company. What else could he offer, besides
    > shares of Hyperion Entertainment, with an imaginary value?

    I must admit the idea is appealing :-)
  • »22.02.19 - 20:56
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > I don't know if you've followed the 3 part article on the X1000
    > in Amiga Future written from Trevor's perspective.

    Only the first page of each part used as teaser on Twitter and Facebook :-)

    > part 3, stated to have newish information on this history

    Yes, even the first page does have new information not made public before :-)

    > you don't happen to have the date when Evert posted and the Dutch docs
    > about the change at A-eon appeared on moobunny, do you?

    I do have the dates and links to the documents of the A-Eon changes (Hermans quits A-Eon CVBA director position, A-Eon Ltd. founded, A-Eon CVBA dissolved), but not any "date when Evert posted and the Dutch docs about the change at A-eon appeared on moobunny", sorry.
  • »22.02.19 - 21:33
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    number6
    Posts: 456 from 2008/8/10
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > I don't know if you've followed the 3 part article on the X1000
    > in Amiga Future written from Trevor's perspective.

    Only the first page of each part used as teaser on Twitter and Facebook :-)

    > part 3, stated to have newish information on this history

    Yes, even the first page does have new information not made public before :-)

    > you don't happen to have the date when Evert posted and the Dutch docs
    > about the change at A-eon appeared on moobunny, do you?

    I do have the dates and links to the documents of the A-Eon changes (Hermans quits A-Eon CVBA director position, A-Eon Ltd. founded, A-Eon CVBA dissolved), but not any "date when Evert posted and the Dutch docs about the change at A-eon appeared on moobunny", sorry.


    Yes, saw your "only after" link in your posts above which has the direct links for anyone who needs to catch up.
    Thank you for checking.

    #6
  • »22.02.19 - 21:43
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
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    Crumb
    Posts: 730 from 2003/2/24
    From: aGaS & CUAZ Al...
    Quote:

    ASiegel wrote:
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    Average IQ in Italy is 102, in Belgium and Germany it's 99. Intelligence usually beats arrogance.

    Yale University article: Why a high IQ doesn't mean you're smart


    I've read the article with interest, however the Professor of Marketing seems to confuse culture/education with intelligence. Somebody could be an intelligent person without education, etc... and being the smartest won't guarantee that you are the most suitable person for a job, perhaps someone not so smart but with better attitude and education is more suitable for certain job. Being smart doesn't mean you are automatically a better person. You don't need the smartest ones for all the jobs anyway as they would become bored easily. There's some trend about resurrecting the obsolete multiple "intelligences" theories but there's just (a single) intelligence. Somebody could have multiple skills but these are not magically turned into "intelligence". Those are other skills and some of these can be learnt. You can learn to solve problems or to be methodic, but you can't magically increase your intelligence when you are a grown up. Having lower IQ than somebody else shouldn't make us ashamed: you are not a worse person, the other person could still be a moron, a smart moron but a moron anyway. And if it's not then much better, we'll have something to learn from him/her.

    [ Edited by Crumb 27.02.2019 - 00:03 ]
  • »26.02.19 - 22:59
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    It's more important to note that IQ is unscientific nonsense. As a concept it was developed to justify eugenics.
  • »27.02.19 - 18:08
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > and all that follows
    > Could be nothing. Could be something. You decide.
    > [...] prior to this it was a wordpress contact page since October,
    > 2017 with all the former "content" removed.

    If I interpret correctly what's been said in this video at about 15:05 and 21:10, the ROT13-coded messages appearing on amiga.com have been from Cloanto all along.

    (The video has some direct messages from Cloanto starting from 19:40.)
  • »11.03.19 - 17:07
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    number6
    Posts: 456 from 2008/8/10
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > and all that follows
    > Could be nothing. Could be something. You decide.
    > [...] prior to this it was a wordpress contact page since October,
    > 2017 with all the former "content" removed.

    If I interpret correctly what's been said in this video at about 15:05 and 21:10, the ROT13-coded messages appearing on amiga.com have been from Cloanto all along.

    (The video has some direct messages from Cloanto starting from 19:40.)


    More relevant perhaps?

    #6
  • »11.03.19 - 19:31
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>> and all that follows
    >>> Could be nothing. Could be something. You decide.
    >>> [...] prior to this it was a wordpress contact page since October,
    >>> 2017 with all the former "content" removed.

    >> If I interpret correctly what's been said in this video at about 15:05 and 21:10,
    >> the ROT13-coded messages appearing on amiga.com have been from Cloanto all
    >> along. (The video has some direct messages from Cloanto starting from 19:40.)

    > More relevant perhaps?

    At least not regarding change of domain ownership :-) Thanks anyway.
  • »11.03.19 - 20:32
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    number6
    Posts: 456 from 2008/8/10
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > and all that follows
    > Could be nothing. Could be something. You decide.
    > [...] prior to this it was a wordpress contact page since October,
    > 2017 with all the former "content" removed.

    If I interpret correctly what's been said in this video at about 15:05 and 21:10, the ROT13-coded messages appearing on amiga.com have been from Cloanto all along.

    (The video has some direct messages from Cloanto starting from 19:40.)


    Apparently none of it surprising, else there would have been some talk.

    #6
  • »11.03.19 - 22:21
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> If I interpret correctly what's been said in this video at about 15:05 and 21:10,
    >> the ROT13-coded messages appearing on amiga.com have been from Cloanto all
    >> along. (The video has some direct messages from Cloanto starting from 19:40.)

    > Apparently none of it surprising, else there would have been some talk.

    https://www.amiga-news.de/de/news/AN-2019-03-00029-DE.html (only German for now)
  • »11.03.19 - 22:41
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    number6
    Posts: 456 from 2008/8/10
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    >> If I interpret correctly what's been said in this video at about 15:05 and 21:10,
    >> the ROT13-coded messages appearing on amiga.com have been from Cloanto all
    >> along. (The video has some direct messages from Cloanto starting from 19:40.)

    > Apparently none of it surprising, else there would have been some talk.

    https://www.amiga-news.de/de/news/AN-2019-03-00029-DE.html (only German for now)


    Still better than having to cut and paste from the video. heh.

    #6
  • »11.03.19 - 23:21
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    takemehomegrandma
    Posts: 2704 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    Senex wrote:
    @number6:

    English translation of our yesterday's news-item is online now:
    https://www.amiga-news.de/en/news/AN-2019-03-00029-EN.html


    ...and here is the link to the very interesting post that you posted in the german comments section only:

    https://amiga-news.de/en/news/comments/305738..html

    Ben Herman’s / Hyperion’s filthy practices are becoming more and more undeniable even to “teh true!!1!” believers. Truth will soon enlighten them. The blind since 18 years will see. And this is why that Nietzsche quote about the future that currently is in the html of amiga.com is so brilliant:

    "The snake which cannot cast its skin has to die. As well the minds which are prevented from changing their opinions; they cease to be mind."
    MorphOS is Amiga done right! :-)
    MorphOS NG will be AROS done right! :-)
  • »12.03.19 - 16:54
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    KennyR
    Posts: 787 from 2003/3/4
    From: #AmigaZeux, Gu...
    Looks like EAB has
    gone full retard in the "bad old AmigaWorld" mode, by censoring one side of the conversation and allowing full scale bashing and linking illegal material against those who it doesn't like.

    And we all know how that ended. Empowered by censoring 'negativity' on AWN, and later Amigans.net (when the loonies could no longer get wrongthinkers banned with a PM to a mod) AmigaONE and OS4 went on to rule the world...

    ...NOT.

    [ Edited by KennyR 13.03.2019 - 17:44 ]
  • »13.03.19 - 17:43
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    takemehomegrandma
    Posts: 2704 from 2003/2/24
    @KennyR

    Amazing that so many seems desperate to re-live the holocaust... :roll:

    "The snake which cannot cast its skin has to die. As well the minds which are prevented from changing their opinions; they cease to be mind."
    MorphOS is Amiga done right! :-)
    MorphOS NG will be AROS done right! :-)
  • »13.03.19 - 18:33
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