> Amiga Kit Blog entry covering last weekend's Amiga 37 show

"The MorphOS stand contained a Commodore Amiga 4000 desktop with a very unexpected surprise: MorphOS version 3.18 running in all of it’s glory! [...] Prior to this development, the last version of MorphOS (1.4.5) for this machine was released all the way back in 2005. A public release date of this latest version is unknown at the time of writing."

Just to clarify, (almost) all shows of the last years with official MorphOS Team attendance have had a recent(ish) MorphOS version running on a PowerUP'd classic Amiga on display. Just have a look at older show reports/pictures/videos for confirmation.* So not really unexpected or a surprise. Needless to say that there never occured any release of such shown version.

* Examples:
Amiga 30: MorphOS 3.8 PowerUP
Amiga 32: MorphOS 3.10 PowerUP Beta
Amiga 34: MorphOS 3.13 PowerUP Beta

[ Edited by Andreas_Wolf 18.10.2022 - 20:29 ]

Andreas

I was unaware of that, but to me it was a very unexpected and nice surprise

a question for the MorphOS team, as it looks like a very interesting proof of concept, but in the same time it is limited by older hardware, but it could be very useful for enticing new amiga users to use MorphOS, why not release next version 3.18 for free who has an old cyberstorm ppc and maybe even blizzard ppc? as was done in the past with MorphOS 1.4.5

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Thanks for the blog, I did watch BigGun, Trevor and few minors and havent heard anything new.
Most refreshing for me was Amiga Bill after Zee Germans :)

Do you, by any chance, plan to get another run of those AEON Prism Megamix clockport music "cards", this time with SPIF,CDDA audio and maybe AHI driver of some sort? Would prepay / reserve that.

In stream, I haven't heard word "MorphOS". Stream was private, by Amitropia and Dark Sbadow on YT, and was constantly down in audio, or even cut. Booths and hall looks great, and its nice there is European Amiga event of this size, but for 37th event one would expect English translators and decent streaming. Seems AmiWest holds same presenters, but somewhat works better for me.

On Trevor AmiGaKit side I listened to every refreshing word of Aussie UK old school style,
and have heard a lot of hope for X5000 040, new kernel and such, but very little to nonne of
mythical creatures like CFE bugfix, x1000 net driver, Enhancer OS 3 (1.x or 2.x?), prepaid OS 4.2 with x1000, Libre Office beta, Octamed update, ImageFX update, Timberwolf completition, new OS4 browser port on amigans.net, official Linux support for x1000, improvements of 68k Linux situation, MOS support for Tabor and x1000, MOS x64, Vampire support in OS 3.2, or any real advancement one could bring.
Books, blogs, Amiga retro collection I had enough. Not that I do not appriciate effort, but its contant failure to deliver meaningfull product, or at least fully support it in software, and bugfixes.


P.S.
When will be website shop fixed? Any chance of filter not to display unavil junk?

Your past x1000 customer/

> for 37th event

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=13371&start=16

> Timberwolf completition

Are you serious?

> official Linux support for x1000

"The upstream kernel supports the Nemo board out of the box."
https://lists.ozlabs.org/pipermail/linuxppc-dev/2021-November/236591.html

> MOS support for Tabor

I don't think (nor hope) that any MorphOS Team member will burden himself with the task of adding support for the e500v2/SPE core.

> MOS x64

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=13295&start=67

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I can confirm that there will be no MorphOS support for the Tabor board.

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Thanks for all the news, very informative as always. I wish website bots are of that quality :)

Very serious. Libre was contantly being repeated in beta on Trevors blog, TW was taken bonty and FF4 port poorely woeking with Friendens HQ public promise to fix it to FF16 - ar least that would be vast improvement. OS3, AROS and MOS port maybe too

Why not, if MOS is staying in PPC camp Acube laptop, newcoming Tabor (existing in hands of newcomers), even old A1 x1000 and new x5000/040 look like viable targets for e.g. MOS PPC64 4.0 (which should be MOS x64 4.0 too ...). More licenses the marrier, and it seems more and more OS4 owners are willing to buy MOS. Me at least, if G5 license wasnt more expensive and iMac G5 not even officially supported annd 30 minutes limit really boooring :) Gimme Ads!

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iMac G5 is not supported, but you can register it. It works.

>>> official Linux support for x1000

>> "The upstream kernel supports the Nemo board out of the box."
>> https://lists.ozlabs.org/pipermail/linuxppc-dev/2021-November/236591.html

> Thanks for all the news

There's nothing new about that, X1000/Nemo has been supported in mainline for some years.

>>> Timberwolf completition

>> Are you serious?

> Very serious. [...] Friendens HQ public promise to fix it to FF16 [...].
> OS3, AROS and MOS port maybe too

It was FF19, and it wasn't a promise as I told you 6 years ago. FF19 is nearly a decade old now. It's ancient and won't work well with current web, even compared to what's there on OS4/AROS, let alone MorphOS.

> Tabor [...] look like viable targets for e.g. MOS PPC64 4.0

No, the QorIQ P1022's e500v2 core is only 32-bit. In addition, read and understand comment #7.

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It may not seem like it, but things have moved on since then. Even if the MorphOS kernel still supports 603/604 (which it should, but I'm not sure), loading Wayfarer for example on a CyberstormPPC would be absolute horror. PIO0 PATA IDE access, 128 MB max RAM, slow RAM speed, slow CPU, Cyberstorm being your fastest gfx option...

[ Edited by KennyR 21.10.2022 - 22:30 ]

> Even if the MorphOS kernel still supports 603/604
> (which it should, but I'm not sure)

As MorphOS 3.18 Beta was shown running on CSPPC, I guess it does.

> PIO0 PATA IDE access

CSPPC has Ultra Wide SCSI controller (40 MB/s with almost no CPU load).

> Cyberstorm being your fastest gfx option...

In case you mean CyberVisionPPC/Permedia2, the show machine was equipped with G-Rex and Voodoo3.

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Nobody makes SCSI hard drives any more Andreas. (Or converters from SAS or SATA to SCSI, for that matter.)

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Interesting - do these have MorphOS drivers?

Andreas, you're doing this again. Your answers contribute nothing but verbiage.

[ Edited by KennyR 22.10.2022 - 18:30 ]

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Even if SCSI hard drives aren't made anymore, I bet almost all CSPPC owners do have SCSI drive in their A4000s (which aren't made either) anyway :) Who would have sticked with IDE if they have that kind of accelerator? Also SCSI to IDE adapters (from Acard etc) were popular when people wanted bigger and cheaper HDs on their SCSI-Amigas.

>>> PIO0 PATA IDE access

>> CSPPC has Ultra Wide SCSI controller (40 MB/s with almost no CPU load).

> Nobody makes SCSI hard drives any more Andreas.

Nobody makes A4000s or CyberStormPPCs any more either, yet people do have them in their possession and do ask for recent MorphOS version for this hardware occasionally. Do you really believe they have a PATA drive on their A4000's onboard controller as the main drive when they have a UW SCSI controller on their CSPPC? And why should they want or need to buy a new SCSI hard drive for MorphOS instead of simply using their existing SCSI hard drive (or existing PATA/SATA hard drive with existing adapter), same as they want to use their existing A4000 and existing CSPPC with current MorphOS?

>>> Cyberstorm being your fastest gfx option...

>> the show machine was equipped with G-Rex and Voodoo3.

> do these have MorphOS drivers?

As the MorphOS Team showed MorphOS 3.18 Beta running on an A4000/CSPPC/G-Rex/Voodoo3 combination at Amiga 37 (and the respective MorphOS versions at previous Amiga 3x shows, which you are definitely aware of), as I wrote and as you can see (screenshot) when you click the links in the posting this thread was opened with, I think even you might be able to work out the answer yourself.

> Andreas, you're doing this again.

Absolutely, I'm not growing tired of correcting your counterfactual nonsense you have a habit of writing.

Not sure how and why it turned into this level of nonsense, but....

Still plenty of PuP/GRex based drivers in MorphOS and the Voodoo3 is the most obvious one (thats why it works in a PMac G4 despite no way to run it's x86 BIOS).

CPU wise the Efika is 603 based, has only 128MB and rather slow RAM and IDE. Yet it has no problems running MorphOS (as long as you don't try OWB/Wayfarer).

No it does not make any sense to run MorphOS on an A4000 when supported PPC Macs can still be had for small money thats why there is (IMO) no point in releasing it but also why it is kinda cool to showcase.

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But not tired of entirely missing the point.

Go ahead, run Wayfarer on your shitty 90s platform and see where you get.

k, I should have just said: this hardware is too old and nobody in the MorphOS team is going to bother with it any more.

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MorphOS has supported the "X5000/40" for like half a decade now. Should MorphOS ever *fully* go 64-bit and/or SMP, then bigfoot's new kernel will most certainly be used. This was shown publicly 3 years ago as a tech demo, running on an AMD Ryzen 5 computer in 64-bit native mode (running MorphOS as a mixture of native AMD64 code and existing PowerPC code). And while bigfoot has confirmed the kernel also runs on X5000 (in fact the X5000 was used during its development), I'd say that the moment a MorphOS "NG" beyond just the kernel would be SMP and/or 64-bit compatible, then both binary compatibility and source compatibility would have been sacrificed and MorphOS "NG" would be more like AROS in a sense, meaning that PPC (including "X5000/40") would be kind of pointless in the sense it would offer *nothing* value adding compared to modern X64 or ARM solutions.

> not tired of entirely missing the point.

You may try to make your point without including false claims for once.

> Go ahead, run Wayfarer on your shitty 90s platform and see where you get.

I sold my A4000 with CSPPC (and Acard AEC-7720UW) back in 2005. My PowerMac G5 is from the same year and runs Wayfarer just fine.

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The point was made and you have failed to rebut it.

There is nothing on these old boards that you can't do with the old MorphOS for Classic that you can do with 3.x, except things like Wayfarer that this hardware is simply too old for.

Even the Efika, which has the computing power of a retarded wristwatch, is at least a stationary target for the MorphOS developers. Practically every CPPC system was a Frankenstein monster of varying parts, the vendors of some of whom had no love for Phase5 at the time.

Edit: and NO, you still aren't going to get far with a 90s HDD even if it has a wide SCSI interface. Period.

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They're not even remotely comparable, and I'm not even going to bother to explain why as you'll just sit there and googlenitpick. Instead, let me just laugh aloud that you tried to compare a G5 (even running one CPU) to a CyberstormPPC.

[ Edited by KennyR 23.10.2022 - 16:06 ]

>> You may try to make your point without including false claims for once.

> The point was made and you have failed to rebut it.

No, I didn't fail to rebut your "point", simply because I never even attempted to rebut your "point". That's just some delusion in your head. What I tried to rebut and have been successful in rebuting are your two false claims in comment #11:

1. Users of A4000 equipped with a CSPPC, which has a UW SCSI controller, are restricted to "PIO0 PATA IDE access".
2. "Cyberstorm [sic] being your fastest gfx option" with an A4000+CSPPC.

In comment #13 you then showed no reluctance to make a fool of yourself by contending that owners of A4000+CSPPC, which stopped being made decades ago, were somehow hindered from running MorphOS 3.x for PowerUP (if released) from a UW-SCSI-connected hard drive by such hard drives (or adapters) not being made anymore. It really takes one special kind of reasoning to come to such conclusion and missing the unintentional hilarity in it.
Furthermore, you asked in comment #13 whether there were MorphOS drivers for hardware (G-Rex, Voodoo3) the MorphOS Team has just showcased recent MorphOS running on (as discussed early on in this thread and specifically told you in comment #12). This may be considered some kind of retarded humour at best.

> There is nothing on these old boards that you can't do with the old
> MorphOS for Classic that you can do with 3.x, except things like Wayfarer
> that this hardware is simply too old for.

Please take this up with Divinity and vox. They're the ones who asked for recent MorphOS to be released for PowerUP hardware. Contrary to what you seem to perceive, I didn't express my opinion on that in this thread.

> the Efika [...] is at least a stationary target [...]. Practically every
> CPPC system was a Frankenstein monster of varying parts [...].

Please take this up with Kronos. He's the one who dragged the Efika into this thread for comparison means (and managed to make purely factual claims, btw). You should know my low opinion of the Efika as a desktop platform quite well. Contrary to what you seem to perceive, I didn't express my opinion on that in this thread.

> you still aren't going to get far with a 90s HDD even if it has a wide SCSI interface.

I used a 2000s PATA HDD connected via Acard AEC-7720UW on my A4000/CSPPC and it got me to 36 MB/s raw speed, which I think even MorphOS 3.x (i.e. the slim OS itself, and even most of its applications) would be fine with. There are numerous shortcomings with attempting to use PowerUP hardware for "Amiga" desktop computing today, but the storage interface (especially on CSPPC) is way down below on that list.

>>> Go ahead, run Wayfarer on your shitty 90s platform and see where you get.

>> I sold my A4000 with CSPPC (and Acard AEC-7720UW) back in 2005.
>> My PowerMac G5 is from the same year and runs Wayfarer just fine.

> They're not even remotely comparable

Nobody claimed they were.

> you tried to compare a G5 (even running one CPU) to a CyberstormPPC.

I didn't. It's just your reading comprehension issues that make you think I did. In actual fact, I tried to clarify your fallacy that I wanted to run Wayfarer "on your shitty 90s platform". As I've not owned such platform for many years (and have no intention of changing that), there's simply no way for me to do what you suggest. My only way to run Wayfarer is on my G5, hence its mention.

> Some PPC32 emu or compatibility layer could be done, like PPC64 does.

The API/ABI incompatibility between current MorphOS and a potential MorphOS NG wouldn't just be about the instruction/address width.

> I am glad my "farsight" is right, next MOS will be PPC64 also.

Huh? Did I miss something?

> I will insta buy AMD64 license, be it that my board is supported and nVIDIA gfx.

I think you can scrap that, on both accounts.

> Tabor [...]. Please support this as cheapest NG hardware

Trevor said at Amiga 37 that due to the world-wide circumstances, final Tabor/A1222 will have to be sold in the Sam460 price range, which means about twice the price it was originally announced at.

> its kinnky CPU (Trevors knows how to get dem fi sure!)

Trevor said at Amiga 37 that the P1022 price has almost quadrupled due to the world-wide circumstances as well as decreasing availability, but which luckily won't affect the project as he had purchased 1000 units in 2014/2015 (old, long-known story). I'm not sure Trevor will produce more boards after selling those 1000 boards (if they even sell out, that is) as that would require him to buy more P1022 units.

> Nemo [...] no distro supported tricky BAT CD Boot
> of x1000 so all install have to be done manually.

https://fienixppc.blogspot.com/p/cfe.html doesn't read too complicated.

> with 603 and 64MB RAM

It's not that bad. CSPPC (604e) supports 128 MiB RAM, BPPC (603e) even 256 MiB.

> gfx card at best

Recent MorphOS likely won't work without graphics card. And really, who has a PowerUP accelerator in his Amiga but no graphics card? Next time some lunatic comes along and says that PowerUP users make no use of their (UW/Fast-)SCSI interface ;-)

> OS4 Classic users face the same. Good thing is it can be ran in UAE now :)

And MorphOS (as well as OS4) can be run in QEMU :-)

> original Linux arch m68k

m68k was only the 2nd ISA Linux ran on.

I think there is a misunderstanding, sorry, let me explain
I happily use MorphOS in four Mac G5 and G4 and in three Pegasos II G4 and G3, but since I also have the A4000 with cyberstormppc I would like to be able to use MorphOS even with this old hardware in a more modern version than 1.4.5 because there are some old Warp3D software and other simple stuff that would be more comfortable for me to use with this A4000 rather than loading them from AmigaOS3.9
With cyberstormppc I use a couple of uwscsi HDs that still work very well and have a good capacity just over 30gb
I have no interest in using Wayfarer with A4000, also because I use it well with my G5 and G4 systems
If it were possible to use MorphOS 3.18 also with cyberstormppc I would be very pleased and if it were free and with no time limits (30 minutes or two hours) I would be even more so

[ Edited by Divinity 23.10.2022 - 23:56 ]

> there are some old Warp3D software [...] that would be more comfortable
> for me to use with this A4000 rather than loading them from AmigaOS3.9

Regarding old Warp3D software, there will be TinyRave for your MorphOS machines with R300+ GPU :-)