AmigaOne X5000: MorphOS does not boot any longer
  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Primax
    Posts: 75 from 2021/7/2
    Hi.

    I have now opened a new thread, based on my requests in the "New Modern Webkit-based Browser In Development" thread (https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=9&topic_id=12823&post_id=151757&viewmode=flat&sortorder=0&showonepost=1)

    Short summary:
    I cannot boot into MorphOS any longer :(
    I see the blue butterfly (and until yesterday the wihte Ambient screen).
    I used my USB stick and I see that the system harddrive is full. 0% free, 8GB full. And I see a red bar on the icon.
    I can access the system partition - when booted with the stick - without any problems. And I tried to find dirs or files with a large size. But I did not.
    If I boot via USB stick, during the selection of language and keyboard I get the following message: "error validating System, Block 10990838 bad header type".

    The info about system partition said: "Filesystem: FFS LNFS"

    Now I also executed 'version dh0:' and it says: State=Validating.

    Andreas posted: "The new Disk Doctor can deal with storage devices in the TB range"
    http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=1274441

    So my questions:
    1.) How long could/can it takes the system to validating the 8GB SSD partition?
    2.) Do I understand it correctly: I could use SDSDoctor?

    Thank you very much!

    PS: Which tool can I use for backing up the system partition? There are no important applications I added so to me it would be sufficient to back up the preferences. That means: Simply copying the whole content of Prefs->Env-Archive?
    AmigaOne X5000 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon X1650 / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition / MorphOS 3.17
    Amiga1200 / Blizzard 1230 IV / 128 MB RAM / AmigaOS 3.9
  • »11.01.22 - 16:11
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  • jPV
  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jPV
    Posts: 1890 from 2003/2/24
    From: po-RNO
    Quote:

    Primax wrote:
    1.) How long could/can it takes the system to validating the 8GB SSD partition?

    I haven't tried to use FFS on next generation machines, but on 68k it was very slow with bigger partitions... like hours or a day :) Probably should be much faster on NG... but as it gave an error about validating, my guess is that it stops there and fails to validate at all.

    Quote:

    2.) Do I understand it correctly: I could use SDSDoctor?

    No, SFSDoctor is only for SFS (SmartFileSystem) partitions. FFS (FastFileSystem) would need something else, but I think that we don't have anything MorphOS native for that. If you have OS4 installed on the same machine, and if it would have something for this, maybe it could be used? Or if that new Disk Doctor for AmigaOS 3.14/3.2 would work under MorphOS and our version of FFS would be compatible with it... do you want to be first to try? :)

    Quote:

    PS: Which tool can I use for backing up the system partition? There are no important applications I added so to me it would be sufficient to back up the preferences. That means: Simply copying the whole content of Prefs->Env-Archive?

    Yeah, I guess ENVARC: could be enough for really plain system... but you also might have stuff in drawers in SYS: (like libs, fonts, c, classes, wbstartup...).

    For backing up I'd use the Copy command in the Shell:
    Copy System:#? BackUp:Directory/ ALL CLONE QUIET

    Or if you have soft links on the partition (MorphOS SDK has them, for example), then it would be better to use some link aware program like MirrorCopy.
  • »11.01.22 - 17:14
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Primax
    Posts: 75 from 2021/7/2
    Thank you very much.
    My retailer does not answer, very disappointing. So I cannot tell why they used FFS.
    Yes, I use AmigaOS 4 as well as MorphOS on my X5000 but they are installed on two different SSDs. And I never have both connected, always only one.

    So, if I understand it right, I should format the system partition with SFS, before I reinstall MorphOS.

    Can you/someone please tell me in a detailed way: How?
    And after that, I reboot via USB stick and start installation?
    AmigaOne X5000 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon X1650 / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition / MorphOS 3.17
    Amiga1200 / Blizzard 1230 IV / 128 MB RAM / AmigaOS 3.9
  • »11.01.22 - 18:09
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    polluks
    Posts: 699 from 2007/10/23
    From: Gelsenkirchen,...
    Quote:

    Primax schrieb:
    So, if I understand it right, I should format the system partition with SFS, before I reinstall MorphOS.

    Indeed, SFS or PFS of 2 GB.
    You may turn on Drivelamps.sbar to see some progress.
    However I use "lock sys: on" to protect my system at the time.
    Pegasos II G4: MorphOS 3.9, Zalman M220W · iMac G5 12,1 17", MorphOS 3.17
    Power Mac G3: OSX 10.3 · PowerBook 5,8: OSX 10.5, MorphOS 3.17
  • »11.01.22 - 19:41
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  • jPV
  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jPV
    Posts: 1890 from 2003/2/24
    From: po-RNO
    Quote:

    Primax wrote:
    So, if I understand it right, I should format the system partition with SFS, before I reinstall MorphOS.

    Can you/someone please tell me in a detailed way: How?
    And after that, I reboot via USB stick and start installation?

    Do you have other partitions with important stuff? If you can lose everything on the SSD, automatic partitioner on the installer creates SFS partitions and everything automatically and would be an easy way (although I'm not sure if there are any extra steps on X5000).

    If you want to keep others but just change the System partition to SFS, launch Tools/HDConfig and change the wanted partition to SFS (blocksize can be 512, buffers are good to be bit bigger than default... I have 4096, automounted and bootable). After saving (maybe a reboot to be sure) format the partition (Utilities/Format... from menu or Tools/Format). Then start installation and select manual partition layout etc.

    8GB is ok size and I don't see need to change that...
  • »11.01.22 - 21:04
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Primax
    Posts: 75 from 2021/7/2
    Thanks so much.
    Yesterday I kept the X5000 running, hoping that validating will be finished. But it did not seem so.
    Does anybody has any experiences with validating under FFS and how much time this could take? I kept it running for about 5 hours...
    AmigaOne X5000 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon X1650 / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition / MorphOS 3.17
    Amiga1200 / Blizzard 1230 IV / 128 MB RAM / AmigaOS 3.9
  • »12.01.22 - 05:09
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  • jPV
  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jPV
    Posts: 1890 from 2003/2/24
    From: po-RNO
    Did you enable that Drivelamps screenbar module to see if there is HD access? Validating should make constant HD access and you should see a Drivelamp flashing indicating about it, or if you have some physical led in the drive/case you could check that too.

    BTW. one thing about backupping that I didn't mention earlier... if you make a backup of your System partition with the commands I told, it's better to backup to a filesystem that preserves Amiga/MorphOS file properties (SFS, PFS, FFS). Backing up to a FAT formatted stick wouldn't be that good idea, unless you create an SFS formatted image file on it, archive it with Tar and --xattrs option, or use some other that kind of trick. And if/when there's an error in the original FFS partition, you should also see if the copying process will stop at some point because of it and then inspect if there's much that didn't get copied...


    [ Edited by jPV 12.01.2022 - 07:52 ]
  • »12.01.22 - 06:49
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Primax
    Posts: 75 from 2021/7/2
    Yes, I have a physical lamp at the front of the my X5000 case.
    The lamp is on all the time....but I am not sure if there is really something going on.
    5 hours!!
    AmigaOne X5000 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon X1650 / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition / MorphOS 3.17
    Amiga1200 / Blizzard 1230 IV / 128 MB RAM / AmigaOS 3.9
  • »12.01.22 - 07:15
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    NewSense
    Posts: 1244 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, UK/GB
    @ Primax -> One thing to note is that if you format a partition to SFS then that is not the same as the OS4 SFS standard - they are not compatible as such AFAIK.

    So the partition will only be writeable through MorphOS IIRC, but it is the best partition/format structure for MorphOS, and as you only use it for MorphOS booting/system then I would still recommend SFS. So, you can at least then use SFSDoctor to fix any/usually seldom/rare or occasional error you get that needs SFSDoctor to fix it. :-D
    Quote:

    Primax wrote: The lamp is on all the time....but I am not sure if there is really something going on. 5 hours!!

    I'd say it's time to give up on salvaging that partition as it was/is, and it's time to re-install it using SFS this time, so at least it is highly likely to be fixed, often by SFS itself if there are any issues from time-to-time - that's just my experience and advice.

    No MorphOS systems were hurt during the time it took to write this . . . AFAIK ! 8-D
    MacMini 1.5GHz,64MB VRAM, PowerBooks A1138/9 (Model 5,8/9),PowerMac G5 2.3GHz(DP), iMac A1145 2.1GHz 20", all with MorphOS v3.17,Airport,Bluetooth,A1016 Keyboard,T-RB22 Mouse,DVD-RW-DL,MiniMax,Firewire/USB2 & MacOSX 10.4/5.
  • »12.01.22 - 07:24
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Brumiga
    Posts: 223 from 2004/4/3
    From: France
    @Primax,

    I am as you an owner of an amigaone x5000 since one year and half. To use it with morphos I have bought a graphic card more compatible that the radeon r7 240 sold new. I have now a radeon hd 5450. First I installed morphos on a hard disk not used I had.

    As tutorials on obligement says I created a little ffs partition for boot.img but it did not boot. I asked here about my problems and cyfm answered me that boot.img has to be copied at the root of the morphos partition. Last year I decided to use an ssd. I install morphos and reboot, but problem with the hyperbootloader not find. I did not install it in the rdb. So check during install or when finish that the hyperbootloader is installed in the rdb of your device, hard disk or ssd. When installing morphos, at the step before install do not choose the automatic layout, it creates ffs lnfs partitions. Choose manually, use hdconfig and create sfs partitions.

    Brumiga
  • »12.01.22 - 14:21
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Primax
    Posts: 75 from 2021/7/2
    Oha...it seems to become complicated...:(
    I thought I could simply format my partition and then install MorphOS again...

    I should definitely not do this "en passant"...It is actually disappointing that my retailer do not reply. So I do not know what it is all about with this FFS.

    By the way,my 'Work' partition has SFS...

    And there is really no tool which I at least could try before I format it...?

    [ Editiert durch Primax 12.01.2022 - 17:06 ]
    AmigaOne X5000 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon X1650 / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition / MorphOS 3.17
    Amiga1200 / Blizzard 1230 IV / 128 MB RAM / AmigaOS 3.9
  • »12.01.22 - 16:59
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    KennyR
    Posts: 805 from 2003/3/4
    From: #AmigaZeux, Gu...
    Quote:

    Primax wrote:
    Thanks so much.
    Yesterday I kept the X5000 running, hoping that validating will be finished. But it did not seem so.
    Does anybody has any experiences with validating under FFS and how much time this could take? I kept it running for about 5 hours...


    Depends on how many files. If you have lots and lots and lots it may take so long that it could actually damage your drive - as in days. A HDD may overheat and take a year's wear, an SSD may wear as well. If you stop and reboot, it just starts off from scratch. It's reading every single file and writing to the bitmap, which is a horrible way to use a mechanical drive that probably made sense back in the late 80s when 10MB drives were common.

    If it's not finishing validating even with a few files then it's an unrecoverable error. Used to be you could use DiskSalv to fix that, but I wouldn't recommend it because of the 64 bit issue.

    Validation write protects the drive but doesn't read protect it. So you can copy your files out into a thumb drive or another partition, and copy them back after format. If it's your system drive boot from a CD beforehand.

    Edit: and if using copy remember to use CLONE, to keep all your file attributes. Losing +S from startup-sequence may result in boot failure. It did on AmigaOS at least.

    [ Edited by KennyR 12.01.2022 - 18:51 ]
  • »12.01.22 - 19:32
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Primax
    Posts: 75 from 2021/7/2
    So, finally my retailer answered....

    To make it short: They are perfectly sure having used the SFS file system.

    This raises two questions for me:

    1.) What kind of (bad) error I have which obviously changes the file system from SFS to FFS (at least it is now recognised as it) but on the other hand is not that heavy so that I can access files and drawers...

    2.) Should I give SFSDoctor a try after all?

    Thanks!
    AmigaOne X5000 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon X1650 / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition / MorphOS 3.17
    Amiga1200 / Blizzard 1230 IV / 128 MB RAM / AmigaOS 3.9
  • »20.01.22 - 18:08
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    NewSense
    Posts: 1244 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, UK/GB
    Quote:

    Primax wrote: So, finally my retailer answered.... To make it short: They are perfectly sure having used the SFS file system.

    Which SFS version did they use -
    1. SFS from the OS4 installation disc media?
    2. SFS from the MorphOS installation media?

    As I mentioned above the 2 OS versions of SFS are incompatible, as such, so you cannot use MorphOS SFSDoctor in conjunction with an OS4 version of SFS file system AFAIK. Check back with your retailer to find out, before you make matters worse than they already are for you, that would be my advice. 8-)
    Quote:

    Primax wrote: This raises two questions for me:
    1.) What kind of (bad) error I have which obviously changes the file system from SFS to FFS...]
    2.) Should I give SFSDoctor a try after all?

    First of all, I don't see why a partition would revert to a partition type it was never formatted with, i.e. from SFS to FFS - that is if your retailer is telling you exactly what they did correctly. :-(

    Also, ensure you are using the SFS filesystem repair tool for the partition type version your HDD has been partitioned/formatted with, or you are just going further into "troubled waters".

    If it has been partitioned/formatted with MorphOS SFS then I think the MorphOS version of SFSDoctor will fix most issues it encounters. However, it's not a save all, so sometimes there's no alternative other than to re-partition or at least re-format the partition of the HDD in question to get it back functional once more.

    If you do end up re-formatting it, then ensure you use the MorphOS installation media to install/format the whole system partition(s) you are going to be using with MorphOS, as I've found SFS to be a highly reliable filesystem, and in the event of an error it's quick to realise, usually, and fix such a problem virtually automatically as it boots up. 8-D
    MacMini 1.5GHz,64MB VRAM, PowerBooks A1138/9 (Model 5,8/9),PowerMac G5 2.3GHz(DP), iMac A1145 2.1GHz 20", all with MorphOS v3.17,Airport,Bluetooth,A1016 Keyboard,T-RB22 Mouse,DVD-RW-DL,MiniMax,Firewire/USB2 & MacOSX 10.4/5.
  • »21.01.22 - 00:35
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  • jPV
  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jPV
    Posts: 1890 from 2003/2/24
    From: po-RNO
    Quote:

    Primax wrote:
    1.) What kind of (bad) error I have which obviously changes the file system from SFS to FFS (at least it is now recognised as it) but on the other hand is not that heavy so that I can access files and drawers...

    I don't think that kind of manual error is possible. If you change the filesystem for a partition without formatting it, next time your boot the system, the partition is in "NODOS" mode where you can't access any files. In this situation you may change the filesystem back to the original and original files will be accessible again, or format the partition to start using the new filesystem with an empty partition.

    Here are the options that come in my mind:
    - You are looking for a wrong partition after all, are you sure it's your installed MorphOS partition that is shown as FFS (usually named as "System"). You're not looking at a boot image partition ("Boot", but maybe this wasn't needed on X5000?), you don't have any SD card or other installation media connected that could mix things? What do you see with the Tools/HDConfig program?
    - Your retailer had made a mistake and the partition has been formatted to FFS from the start. Most likely option?
    - There has been some memory corruption that has written in the wrong position on the disk and mixed partition info... I'd see this very unlikely option.


    Quote:

    2.) Should I give SFSDoctor a try after all?

    I still don't think it's going to do anything good, but I guess it's no harm to check or scan the partition, but don't do any actions that would write on the disk before you are decided to format the partition as your next step.
  • »21.01.22 - 06:17
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