Discussion of the Tabor / A1222 mainboard
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9433 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > There are 3 major players here, Acube, A-Eonkit and HYPErion, all 3 have a stake in this board.

    Spectre660 also mentioned Varisys:

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=11137&start=186

    My question whether Varisys is the board designer remained unanswered. Varisys already offer a P1022-based product, so they have experience with (and maybe also stock of) this chip:

    http://www.varisys.co.uk/products/processor-modules/comexp/com6-p1100/

    On the other hand, if Varisys is the designer, what's ACube's role in this?

    > it reminds me of the Netbook fiasco from a few years back. [...] There are a lot
    > of parallels. [...]

    I don't see the parallels. The LimeBook Z9 was a third-party product existing completely independent of OS4, whereas the Tabor board has been created with the intention of running OS4 in the first place.

    > Speculation was the port was being pushed since Limebooks were available at
    > the time for liquidation on Alibaba. Did the same thing happen with this CPU?

    I don't think this makes sense. The parts cost of the SoC is just too low compared to the overall BOM and design costs.
  • »14.10.15 - 15:28
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9433 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Circles .
    > https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=6465&forum=11

    Exactly. The link to the proper comment (i.e. discussing FPU incompatibility and scrapping P1022 idea subsequently) by feanor is to be found therein:

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=11137&start=187

    Btw, an even older attempt at using e500v2 for OS4:

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=8473&start=43 (2nd half of posting)
  • »14.10.15 - 15:45
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9433 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Maybe try to get some info on the Sam460cr. Did it ever really go on sale?

    At least there're people who have one, e.g.:

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=11256
    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=11137&start=118
  • »14.10.15 - 15:59
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1723 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:

    At least the former characteristic wasn't enough to prevent the Sam460 and X5000 ports ;-)


    True, but the SAM 460 is the first new hardware supported by MorphOS and that was really the point of that port. As for the X5000, the Team was asked by A-Eon to make that port and since the specs are better than the SAM it's not senseless either. As for this board ... not much sense there.
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
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  • »14.10.15 - 17:25
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  • MorphOS Developer
    cyfm
    Posts: 369 from 2003/4/11
    From: Germany
    Quote:

    Yasu schrieb:
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:

    At least the former characteristic wasn't enough to prevent the Sam460 and X5000 ports ;-)


    True, but the SAM 460 is the first new hardware supported by MorphOS and that was really the point of that port. As for the X5000, the Team was asked by A-Eon to make that port and since the specs are better than the SAM it's not senseless either. As for this board ... not much sense there.


    I agree that there is actually not much point to support this boards from a perspective of generating stunning license sales or vast expansion of the userbase.
    Probably the only reasons we spent energy on porting MorphOS to those boards were that people always claimed that MorphOS only supported old or "used" hardware and of course because we can ... :)
  • »14.10.15 - 18:06
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1723 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    @pega-1

    "Because we can" is probably the only reason. But wouldn't it be painfully slow with it's non standard FPU?
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
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  • »14.10.15 - 18:24
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  • MorphOS Developer
    cyfm
    Posts: 369 from 2003/4/11
    From: Germany
    Quote:

    Yasu schrieb:
    @pega-1

    "Because we can" is probably the only reason. But wouldn't it be painfully slow with it's non standard FPU?


    We are aware of this board for a while.
    Due to its obvious limitations there is not much point to port the current MorphOS system to it, though.
    The lacking FPU compatibility is a major showstopper to make proper use of it with MorphOS as we know it.
    So just "because we can" is a pretty void argument in that case.
  • »14.10.15 - 18:37
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9433 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > As for the X5000, the Team was asked by A-Eon to make that port and since the specs
    > are better than the SAM it's not senseless either.

    But it's also much more expensive, and you were talking about bad price/performance as reasoning for not porting MorphOS. I'm not sure the X5000 is really better than the Sam460 in this regard, rather to the contrary.
  • »14.10.15 - 19:58
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1723 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    @Andreas_Wolf

    It's faster and got more of everything. The price tag isn't good on either the SAM or X5000. It's for true fans only, those who don't care about such things as "most bang for your buck".
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
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  • »14.10.15 - 20:17
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9433 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > It's faster and got more of everything.

    If it's x times faster but y>x times more expensive, the price/performance, which was your reasoning for not porting MorphOS, is worse. I'm getting the sense that you somehow don't want to apply your original reasoning as measure anymore ;-)
  • »14.10.15 - 20:51
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1723 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    My point is that SAM is low end and X5000 mid/high end. So there is no point at supporting yet another pricy low end system, especially when it got a faulty FPU.
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
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  • »14.10.15 - 21:31
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Spectre660
    Posts: 96 from 2015/6/30
    No official price for Tabor has been announced.
    Figure quoted is not correct.

    http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40622&forum=2&start=300&viewmode=flat&order=0#770615

    [ Edited by Spectre660 14.10.2015 - 18:47 ]
  • »14.10.15 - 22:46
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9433 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> I'm getting the sense that you somehow don't want to apply your original reasoning
    >> as measure anymore ;-)

    > My point is that SAM is low end and X5000 mid/high end.

    Thanks for confirmation :-)

    > it got a faulty FPU

    This is certainly not true.
  • »14.10.15 - 23:33
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1111 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Spectre660 wrote:
    No official price for Tabor has been announced.
    Figure quoted is not correct.

    http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopThat'sic&topic_id=40622&forum=2&start=300&viewmode=flat&order=0#770615


    That is an interesting comment. Why did we have reports out of the show saying it would be in the 700-1,000Euro range. I doubt these person(s) would just lie. Could be mistaken or could be some backtracking. Who knows, but sure follows a specific tradition in the Kommunity.

    Anyhow, if the board ends up for sale at a significant discount to the Sam460cr it would make a little more sense.
  • »15.10.15 - 14:26
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Everblue
    Posts: 141 from 2004/1/6
    "Quoted prices are VERY high". In my book very high is overpriced by at least 40%. Which would make the price very, very desirable. Hopefully the FPU thing wont be a deal breaker.
  • »15.10.15 - 17:22
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1111 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Everblue wrote:
    "Quoted prices are VERY high". In my book very high is overpriced by at least 40%. Which would make the price very, very desirable. Hopefully the FPU thing wont be a deal breaker.


    To me the price would have to be under $300(USD) to be reasonable. I still wouldn't want one, but it would be less insane. A good comparison would be the C64-Reloaded which can only sell a small finite amount due to needing NOS chips.
  • »15.10.15 - 19:33
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Sprocki
    Posts: 107 from 2005/2/23
    From: Berlin - Germany
    Quote:

    redrumloa wrote:

    Why did we have reports out of the show saying it would be in the 700-1,000Euro range. I doubt these person(s) would just lie. Could be mistaken or could be some backtracking.



    I talked to one member of the A-EON Linux team (printed on his blue sweatshirt and this is how he introduced himself to me; actually I missed to ask him for his real name or nick name but from the disagreement in this thread I guess it was not Spectre660) at their booth and he told me that he would like to see the board selling for about 700 to 1,000 EUR, seeing it as a Sam460 successor. So this was his personal opinion about the price and same as he told it to me I assume he told it to other visitors as well. This is where the public information about this price tag comes from, I suppose. There was no price officially announced, so we have to wait for an official statement.
  • »15.10.15 - 20:37
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9433 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > I talked to one member of the A-EON Linux team (printed on his blue sweatshirt and this
    > is how he introduced himself to me; actually I missed to ask him for his real name or
    > nick name [...]) at their booth and he told me that he would like to see the board
    > selling for about 700 to 1,000 EUR, seeing it as a Sam460 successor.

    If it was this guy (on the right), this is Christian "xeno74" Zigotzky.
  • »15.10.15 - 21:55
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Sprocki
    Posts: 107 from 2005/2/23
    From: Berlin - Germany
    It's him.
  • »15.10.15 - 22:11
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1111 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Sprocki wrote:

    I talked to one member of the A-EON Linux team (printed on his blue sweatshirt and this is how he introduced himself to me; actually I missed to ask him for his real name or nick name but from the disagreement in this thread I guess it was not Spectre660) at their booth and he told me that he would like to see the board selling for about 700 to 1,000 EUR, seeing it as a Sam460 successor. So this was his personal opinion about the price and same as he told it to me I assume he told it to other visitors as well. This is where the public information about this price tag comes from, I suppose. There was no price officially announced, so we have to wait for an official statement.


    Thank you.
  • »15.10.15 - 22:57
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Posts: 130 from 2015/8/23
    As usual, some apes began to throw shit on a-eon and powerpc technology in general.
    The product is not yet available, apes did not intend to use it.
    But, apes consider it is their duty to throw shit.
    This is stupid and in no way help the MOS.
    Dear Jim, if you have a problem with that someone will use something that you do not want to personally use, this means that the problem is with your head.
    Get some rest, go to the bar and drink some beers, maybe it will help you.
  • »16.10.15 - 08:45
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    BSzili
    Posts: 433 from 2012/6/8
    From: Hungary
    The product was publicly demonstrated at a computer show, and there are well known issues (incompatible FPU) with the CPU they chose for the board. Why are you so discombobulated by the fact that people are discussing this?
    I see the jimmies have been rustled.
  • »16.10.15 - 09:10
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1723 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    Thanks for calling people who are concerned about design problems "apes". Your debating skills are admirable.

    [edit] By the way, I like the X5000 (and what Trevor does for the community). I can't afford one though.

    [ Edited by Yasu 16.10.2015 - 10:58 ]
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
    AMIGA FORUM - Sweden's Amiga Magazine!

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  • »16.10.15 - 09:51
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  • ASiegel
    Posts: 897 from 2003/2/15
    From: Central Europe
    Quote:

    ppcamiga1 wrote:
    As usual, some apes began to throw shit on a-eon and powerpc technology in general.
    The product is not yet available, apes did not intend to use it.
    But, apes consider it is their duty to throw shit.
    This is stupid and in no way help the MOS.
    Dear Jim, if you have a problem with that someone will use something that you do not want to personally use, this means that the problem is with your head.
    Get some rest, go to the bar and drink some beers, maybe it will help you.

    Your post and all replies to it have been moved. Please refrain from opening new discussion topics for posts that fit entirely well in existing and still active discussion threads. Thank you.
  • »16.10.15 - 10:37
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