X1000
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    amyren
    Posts: 196 from 2010/5/15
    From: Norway
    Quote:


    Rajinder wrote:
    @mos developers
    if that t-dick bloke were to supply an x1000 would you consider porting mos to the machine.

    or would that just be a no no ?...

    (i did read in a ami org forum, that the dick bloke would be up for it been porting over)
    i know people say about the price of it, but how much was the amigaone and peg boards new


    About that "t-dick bloke"...
    Just reading the recent interview with Trevor Dickinson.
    Apple is mentioned, and he stated he doesnt like Apple. He does have an Apple product, but with MorphOS on it :)
  • »30.06.10 - 10:07
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9750 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Apple is mentioned, and he stated he doesnt like Apple. He does have an
    > Apple product, but with MorphOS on it :)

    Yes, it has been known for years that he likes and uses MorphOS.

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=7186&forum=11&post_id=74362#74362
  • »30.06.10 - 10:40
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jcmarcos
    Posts: 1178 from 2003/3/13
    From: Pinto, Madrid ...
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:

    it has been known for years that he likes and uses MorphOS.


    I remember a certain "trevordisk" user, maybe even here, in MorphZone. Then, why sending his investors down the AmigaOS route, which is inferior MorphOS? Thes "tha brand" have that much power?
  • »30.06.10 - 11:52
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9750 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > I remember a certain "trevordisk" user, maybe even here, in MorphZone.

    I take it you mean "trevordick", not "trevordisk". And you're right, he's been a MorphZone member since October 2005:

    https://morph.zone/userinfo.php?uid=1754

    And yes, it was somewhat stupid from me to refer to his amigaworld.net postings when the evidence is right here on MorphZone ;-)

    > Then, why sending his investors down the AmigaOS route, which is
    > inferior MorphOS? Thes "tha brand" have that much power?

    I don't know his motivation for preferring OS4 over MorphOS in this regard. It might have to do with brand recognition, yes. You have to keep in mind that according to Dickinson the X1000 endeavour started in 2007, i.e. way before the release of MorphOS 2.0. And I think you remember how MorphOS development was publically perceived back then.

    Btw, his stance on the MorphOS pricing strategy (150 EUR per licence back then and before availability of Mac G4 version, though):
    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=6316&forum=3&post_id=63311#63311
  • »30.06.10 - 12:51
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    SoundSquare
    Posts: 1188 from 2004/12/1
    From: Paris, France
    Quote:

    I take it you mean "trevordick", not "trevordisk". And you're right, he's been a MorphZone member since October 2005:


    though he's not a diskhead i still don't want him to suck my disk.
  • »30.06.10 - 13:12
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9750 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > If MorphOS moves to the X86 platform, I will stay with Windows.

    In a recent interview Pascal "phoenixkonsole" Papara (the man behind AresOne and AROS distribution Broadway) told:

    "On the Amiga Event in Essen someone told me that even the MorphOS Team said they will stop using PowerPC in 2013."
    http://obligement.free.fr/articles_traduction/itwpapara_en.php

    Would be interesting to know who this "someone" was and if this "someone's" alleged statement resembles the truth in any way. Maybe the MorphOS Team can clarify if there really ever was such definite thing (like "2013") said by them.
  • »03.08.10 - 22:34
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4593 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:


    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > If MorphOS moves to the X86 platform, I will stay with Windows.

    In a recent interview Pascal "phoenixkonsole" Papara (the man behind AresOne and AROS distribution Broadway) told:

    "On the Amiga Event in Essen someone told me that even the MorphOS Team said they will stop using PowerPC in 2013."
    http://obligement.free.fr/articles_traduction/itwpapara_en.php

    Would be interesting to know who this "someone" was and if this "someone's" alleged statement resembles the truth in any way. Maybe the MorphOS Team can clarify if there really ever was such definite thing (like "2013") said by them.


    Clearly a statement that requires a response.
    I'd hate to have devoted this much time to PPC systems if there is such a time table.
    Any developers (especially those who were at Essen) care to comment?
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »04.08.10 - 02:13
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    amiades
    Posts: 230 from 2005/6/2
    From: Asturies, Spain
    Quote:

    "On the Amiga Event in Essen someone told me that even the MorphOS Team said they will stop using PowerPC in 2013."


    Perhaps 2012's "End of the world" is the reason? xD Only Amiga 2000s will survive thanks to their 2mm metal case.
  • »04.08.10 - 07:13
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jcmarcos
    Posts: 1178 from 2003/3/13
    From: Pinto, Madrid ...
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:
    Quote:

    "someone told me that even the MorphOS Team said they will stop using PowerPC in 2013"


    I'd hate to have devoted this much time to PPC systems if there is such a time table.


    Your could easily put your hate aside if, in the end, you get a better computer to run your favourite software on. Being "better computer" defined as faster, with more functions, cheaper and widely available. PowerPC processors are nice, of course, but not enough to tie a life to them. We'd already made that mistake with the original Amiga chipset. Many of the ones surviving suffer no hate after replacing them with regular components, driven by regular buses.

    Now, let's face the idea of porting such a tight operating system and drivers to, say, 1,000,000 possible combination of pieces that people call "PC". Even if the MorphOS Team is a small crowd of geniuses, I'd be terrified at that scenario.
  • »04.08.10 - 07:30
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Get27
    Posts: 87 from 2004/8/23
    It's logic, when all interesting PowerPC Mac will be supported, it will be the end.
    So, it will be time to switch again (we have ever switched from 68k to PPC).
    No problem for me, i will follow.

    [ Edité par Get27 le 4/8/2010 13:32 ]
    PowerMac 3.5, G4 1.0GHz DP, 1 GB ram, 80GB HD + NAS, Radeon 9600 128MB Mac, 22" 1680x1050
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    Amiga 500+, 68010, 2MB chipram, 4MB fastram, IDE68k, HxC Floppy E
  • »04.08.10 - 11:31
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    amigadave
    Posts: 2502 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Shastina,...
    In 2013 we and the MorphOS Team won't have to worry about which computer architecture we will all be using because according to the Mayan calendar and Nostradamus we are all going to be dead because the World is going to end in December of 2012. :lol:

    If no other more interesting computer platform is invented before then (which is not likely unless it is already in development now and almost ready for production), I have no problem with the MorphOS Team porting to x86/x64 hardware. If/when they do such a switch to x86/x64, I think they should pick a few specific sets of mobo's and components to support, or just support the same hardware that AROS is supporting, instead of trying to support too many different combinations and spreading themselves too thin. Quality over quantity with perhaps at least one low end configuration and one high end workstation supported so people can choose which one they want to buy.
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »04.08.10 - 11:55
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  • ZB
  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    ZB
    Posts: 115 from 2008/9/29
    Quote:


    Get27 wrote:
    It's logic, when all interesting PowerPC Mac will be supported, it will be the end.
    So, it will be time to switch again (we have ever switched from 68k to PPC).
    No problem for me, i will follow.



    I will follow also...
    ---
    Morphing the Phoenix...
  • »04.08.10 - 12:04
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9750 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > according to the Mayan calendar and Nostradamus we are all going to be dead
    > because the World is going to end in December of 2012.

    That's a common misconception regarding the implications of the Mayan calendar. See:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_phenomenon#Mesoamerican_Long_Count_calendar
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesoamerican_Long_Count_calendar#2012_and_the_Long_Count

    And I'm not aware of Nostradamus having said anything about 2012.
  • »04.08.10 - 13:24
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9750 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Clearly a statement that requires a response. [...] Any developers (especially
    > those who were at Essen) care to comment?

    Unfortunately no public comment from any MorphOS Team member yet (unless I missed something). But there's some more info from Pascal Papara:

    http://www.amiga-news.de/de/news/comments/251888.html (German)

    Paraphrased: This "someone" who told about the alleged MorphOS 'roadmap' is no MorphOS Team member himself. He was a normal guest at Essen, wearing a "MOS-Team-shirt"(*). And he is a regular visitor of geit's hardware meetings.

    (*) I guess Pascal means "MorphOS T-shirt", without the "Team" part.


    As long as the MorphOS Team stays silence on this matter the only way to know more about that curious statement is to identify this "someone" (or let him identify himself) and ask him the necessary question(s).
  • »04.08.10 - 15:00
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9750 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    Update:

    > Unfortunately no public comment from any MorphOS Team member
    > yet [...] As long as the MorphOS Team stays silence on this matter...

    What seems to be an official clarification from the MorphOS Team is there at last:

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=7289&forum=3

    Thanks Piru!
  • »04.08.10 - 16:44
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4593 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Well, now that Piru has cleared that one up I feel relieved.
    Pascal's statement did seem questionable. He'd also made a statement about other things he knew that he couldn't talk about. And his statement seemed to bolster his own position and endeavors.

    Oh, and on the world ending in 2012, it would do us all good to remember that the world may not end during the time our species is on it. However, since the vast majority of species that have existed are now extinct, we may not continue to inhabit it indefinitely.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »04.08.10 - 16:53
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Charvel
    Posts: 97 from 2007/2/15
    One day, when the PPCmacs are growing really old and slow, of course they need to make a jump to another CPU-family. And Iḿ pretty sure it will be X86. But now?
    No, Morphos is superfast even on a Peg 1. with a G4 or G5 there is more speed than a MorphOS user will need.
    Only support for newer graphic-cards needed.
  • »04.08.10 - 20:26
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  • Caterpillar
    Caterpillar
    BurnTwice
    Posts: 38 from 2009/10/27
    @ jcmarcos

    True, you have a great variety of components in the PC sector.
    On the other hand, the amount of different chipsets has declined over the years since PCs conquered the marked and a lot of companies were founded. Today, there are few left in comparison.

    But development is fast and therefore time is short to support new components (drivers), especially for small market companies in the Amigaoid sector.

    Even for Apple this seems to be the point, they select hardware for each line of their products, so in model x is always the same hardware which can be supported thoroughly. The product cycles are not so fast like in the Wintel world, the same with consoles etc.

    Quite the strategy like in the good old home computer times :-)

    To put it all into a nutshell, I see no problem to switch to
    specific X86 systems and to support it. And...why not profit again from Apple?s efforts and after their PPC-machines support their well tested X86 machines in the future? ;-)
  • »04.08.10 - 22:24
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    amigadave
    Posts: 2502 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Shastina,...
    I think that idea, to support Intel powered Mac computers if/when the MorphOS Dev. Team makes a switch away from PPC to any other architecture will very likely be met with several loud cries against such a move, from those that do not like Apple products, usually because they do not like the company, or Steve Jobs, but also because the price of Intel Macs is higher than similar hardware used to build a generic PC, or PC's manufactured by other high volume PC manufacture's, such as Dell, HP/Compaq and others.

    I like Apple products, so I would not mind being able to continue dual booting into MorphOS and MacOSX on an Apple computer w/Intel inside, but I fear I am in the minority and most would prefer a cheaper option to build their own x86 MorphOS machines than pay the high prices of new Intel Mac computers, or to have to repeat the process of purchasing used first generation Intel hardware, instead of what ever is current at that time.

    jcmarcos wrote:
    [QUOTE] But development is fast and therefore time is short to support new components (drivers), especially for small market companies in the Amigaoid sector. [/QUOTE]

    I don't quite understand your statement quoted above, as I believe the opposite. I think that due to the small size of the MorphOS Dev. Team, it will take an extended time for the MorphOS Dev. Team to support the latest x86/x64 hardware, compared to the other mainstream OSes, and we will always be using hardware that is some months, or perhaps even years behind the latest and greatest, just released hardware that has Windows, or MacOSX support and to a slightly lesser degree, hardware supported by Linux and other niche x86/x64 OSes that are already established.

    Perhaps I am misunderstanding what you are meaning, or trying to write?
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »05.08.10 - 06:21
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jcmarcos
    Posts: 1178 from 2003/3/13
    From: Pinto, Madrid ...
    Hey Dave, that quote isn't from me! I don't understand it, either. We should all be very aware of one thing: Compare people's personal taste about a component they actually don't know (the CPU) with the HUGE job of rewriting software for a different one. People's likes simply don't compute.
  • »05.08.10 - 08:22
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    amigadave
    Posts: 2502 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Shastina,...
    Oops! Sorry for the mistake with the name of the poster of that quote. I see that it was a response to you, not from you.

    You are right, specially with Amiga users, people's likes DO NOT COMPUTE! :lol:
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »05.08.10 - 08:36
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    boot_wb
    Posts: 874 from 2007/4/9
    From: Kingston upon ...
    Quote:


    amigadave wrote:
    jcmarcos wrote:
    [QUOTE] But development is fast and therefore time is short to support new components (drivers), especially for small market companies in the Amigaoid sector. [/QUOTE]

    I don't quite understand your statement quoted above, as I believe the opposite. I think that due to the small size of the MorphOS Dev. Team, it will take an extended time for the MorphOS Dev. Team to support the latest x86/x64 hardware, compared to the other mainstream OSes, and we will always be using hardware that is some months, or perhaps even years behind the latest and greatest, just released hardware that has Windows, or MacOSX support and to a slightly lesser degree, hardware supported by Linux and other niche x86/x64 OSes that are already established.

    Perhaps I am misunderstanding what you are meaning, or trying to write?


    I assumed he was trying to say that component development time (and hence lifecycle) is short, not MorphOS driver development time - consequently there is not much time available for MorphOS development team to write drivers for newer chipsets.
    www.hullchimneyservices.co.uk

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  • »05.08.10 - 13:26
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  • Caterpillar
    Caterpillar
    BurnTwice
    Posts: 38 from 2009/10/27
    @ boot_wb and others

    Ehmm, sorry if I failed to express myself more clearly...

    I meant that supporting up to date hardware on the PC side is quite difficult because product cycles are short and manpower on the MorphOS side small.

    Therefore, it makes more sense (I think) to choose Apple X86 machines as targets for MorphOS (if there was a decision to switch to X86 some day) than to pick a short lived PC-Setup from the shelf.
    Each Apple X86 line of computers has a defined and well tested setup of components. In the future these models could be bought second hand and some specific ones (with appropriate setup) chosen to be supported.

    To make it short, I meant to use Apple X86s as a target platform for MorphOS in the future like Apple PPCs are used at present, with the same advantages.

    I hope to have made it more clear now...
  • »06.08.10 - 00:40
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    amigadave
    Posts: 2502 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Shastina,...
    Thanks for clearing up my confused head. Your idea to have the MorphOS Dev Team choose a few x86 Mac models to support if/when they decide to move on and away from the PPC architecture and to the x86/x64 architecture, is not a bad idea and I for one would support that idea, as I like MacOSX almost as much as MorphOS2.5 and AmigaOS3.9 and would not mind buying Intel powered Macs in the future to run MorphOS on. I could then install MorphOS2.x, Amithlon, AROS, MacOSX, Windows7 and Linux Ubuntu on different partitions and Sextuple boot into any of the 6 OSes I want to run at that time, and also use WinUAE to boot AmigaOS1.3 to 3.9 for yet another AmigaOS choice.

    I already have a Black 2.16GHz Core2Duo MacBook that I used to use more than any other computer I own. I say used because I am typing this message on my "New-to-ME" 17" 1.67GHz G4 PowerBook which will be my most used computer from now on and I am going to sell my MacBook tomorrow (it is not that I don't like my MacBook, it's great, but I love the screen size of this 17" PowerBook and I can hardly wait to put MorphOS2.? on it as soon as it is released some time in the future. This PowerBook looks like new and I think will resist wear better than the black MacBook, which works great, but could use a new keyboard, trackpad and wrist rest (top of inside case which surrounds the keyboard) as they have worn smooth and shiny in contrast to the flat black of the rest of the case, so it is very noticeable.

    The 1.67GHz G4 is noticeably slower than the 2.16GHz Core2Duo while browsing the Internet, but I don't know if that is only due to the CPU difference, or if part of the difference could be caused by weaker video card and wireless network card inside the older G4 PowerBook?

    Lucky for all of you that I can't keep my eyes open one more minute, so I am not going to finish my thoughts here tonight. I'll ramble on more about this thread tomorrow.
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »06.08.10 - 08:48
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jcmarcos
    Posts: 1178 from 2003/3/13
    From: Pinto, Madrid ...
    Quote:

    BurnTwice wrote:

    supporting up to date hardware on the PC side is quite difficult because product cycles are short and manpower on the MorphOS side small.


    You are right... But only in part! See, the Team is actually supporting a very important part of the system, relying on, precisely PC hardware: Those old but nice ATi graphics cards.

    Quote:

    it makes more sense (I think) to choose Apple X86 machines as targets for MorphOS


    Thant's not required, thankfully: Products from that brand are known for excellent engineering and build quality, but outrageous prices for the functions they feature.

    If. If. If. If. If MorphOS for PCs ever exists, the team won't ask you to buy a certain PC model. They'll just say which chips MorphOS 4.0 supports, and you'll have to find a computer that has them all finely soldered or plugged in. If you think about it, it's no different from the current sittuation.

    Quote:

    amigadave wrote:

    my "New-to-ME" 17" 1.67GHz G4 PowerBook which will be my most used computer from now on and I am going to sell my MacBook tomorrow


    WOOOHOOO! x86 being ditched for PowerPC! Now the world has turned upside down! Go Dave! Is that suporting a pltform or what?
  • »06.08.10 - 09:01
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