Pegasos 2 HDD/SSD SATA options
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    >> In theory - if you succeed to find (or make) some AGPx1->PCI riser
    >> [...] you can try PCI card in AGP slot

    > I see if I can find it.

    Good luck. I've never seen such thing.

    Me also not. Only xserve G4 have similar 90° riser.
    You need AGP 1x v1.0, 3.3V and PCI v2.1 3.3V 66MHz.
    If you very need it, you have to made it. ;-) It looks easy.
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »21.05.20 - 08:32
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Quote:

    connor wrote:
    Here I use SFS. And for SFS the Max Transfer is 0xffffffff and Mask (on the right to it) is 0x7ffffffe.

    It's default value, thus OK. I don't know why you have such slow speed. You can try other disk and other cable. If I copy real big files IDE <-> SiL SATA, I have around 30MB/s.

    Code:
    System:> time copy Backup:test.data Work:

    Time Elapsed: 25.5951s

    System:> ls -al Work:test.data
    -rwx------ 1 nobody nogroup 805306368 May 2 19:25 Work:test.data

    This result is file from SATA HDD(SiI controller) to SATA SSD (internal IDE+Axago IDE-SATA adapter). I don't remember, if it was before overclocking or after.
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »21.05.20 - 08:48
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Brumiga
    Posts: 241 from 2004/4/3
    From: France
    @Connor,

    You have set up too few buffers for your partitions. Type the command addbuffer in a cli/shell to know how much buffers you have for all your partitions. Where have you find this value of 64 for the buffers of each partition ?

    I have searched on obligement.free.fr by typing 'installation morphos' and here are the results with differents versions of morphos. At the beginnings of morphos 1.4.x with scsciconfig the buffers setup was 600 for each partition. With morphos 2.0 this value was lowered to 300 for each partition. On the article morphos 2.6/2.7 as 2.x/3.x the value is the same, 300. On most recent articles about morphos 3.0/3.9 and 3.10/3.12 the value indicated is lowered to 128 but on grabbed pictures the value is steel 300.

    By tries increase the buffers value for each partition to 128 or 300 and verify how better the datas throughput are. This will take a few more memory but if the transferts are better it is not a problem.

    Brumiga
  • »21.05.20 - 14:10
    Profile
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12073 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>>> In theory - if you succeed to find (or make) some AGPx1->PCI riser
    >>>> [...] you can try PCI card in AGP slot

    >>> I see if I can find it.

    >> Good luck. I've never seen such thing.

    > xserve G4 have similar 90° riser.
    > You need AGP 1x v1.0, 3.3V and PCI v2.1 3.3V 66MHz.

    Very nice find, I wasn't aware of this riser. The AGP side seems compatible with the Pegasos 2 and the (64-bit) PCI side seems compatible with (32-bit) Radeon HD cards. Would be cool if someone tried in his Pegasos and compared performance with the same Radeon HD card installed directly in 33 MHz PCI slot.
  • »21.05.20 - 16:10
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Last rest - I need to find new free place for photos
    Quote:

    connor wrote:
    > Only things what I did against this is new power supply and proper cooling:
    I used oversized passive cooler with fan, passive cooler on RAM, passive coolers on Northbridge and Southbridge.

    But on the pictures I see only active coollers (fans). Do you have other pcitures? And which passive colllers do you use?

    Passive coolers - 13-northbridge.jpg, 14-southbridge.jpg, 12-memory.jpg, 10-GPU1.jpg, 11-GPU2.jpg
    coolers for north+southbridge are Primecooler PC-RHS5 (for graphics card mem chips),
    cooler for memory is Thermaltake 839280002127,
    cooler for overclocked Radeon 9800 is modified THERMALRIGHT V-1 Ultra.
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »22.05.20 - 08:48
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > xserve G4 have similar 90° riser.
    > You need AGP 1x v1.0, 3.3V and PCI v2.1 3.3V 66MHz.

    Very nice find, I wasn't aware of this riser. The AGP side seems compatible with the Pegasos 2 and the (64-bit) PCI side seems compatible with (32-bit) Radeon HD cards. Would be cool if someone tried in his Pegasos and compared performance with the same Radeon HD card installed directly in 33 MHz PCI slot.

    Exactly this I have in plan. I want to buy this riser, and wait for some cheap HD 4350 PCI. I don't need 3D, but want video accel, thus HD 5450 have no sense for me (yet). And if it will work and be faster then Radeon 9800, I try to produce riser that fits to Pegasos.
    Right to say, that this plan is very very long-term... ;-)
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »22.05.20 - 08:55
    Profile
  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    connor
    Posts: 570 from 2007/7/29
    Quote:

    sailor wrote:
    Quote:

    connor wrote:
    Here I use SFS. And for SFS the Max Transfer is 0xffffffff and Mask (on the right to it) is 0x7ffffffe.

    It's default value, thus OK. I don't know why you have such slow speed. You can try other disk and other cable. If I copy real big files IDE <-> SiL SATA, I have around 30MB/s.

    Code:
    System:> time copy Backup:test.data Work:

    Time Elapsed: 25.5951s

    System:> ls -al Work:test.data
    -rwx------ 1 nobody nogroup 805306368 May 2 19:25 Work:test.data

    This result is file from SATA HDD(SiI controller) to SATA SSD (internal IDE+Axago IDE-SATA adapter). I don't remember, if it was before overclocking or after.



    I already tried several disks. The cable is new and good. I copied from SATA one SFS partition to another SFS partition. If I copy such large files then I have to wait for hours because it only achieves (in average) a bit more han 1MB/s. It is also like this when I copy only on the IDE disk from one poarttion to another or from IDE to SATA or from SATA to IDE.
  • »22.05.20 - 13:10
    Profile
  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    connor
    Posts: 570 from 2007/7/29
    Quote:

    Brumiga wrote:
    @Connor,

    You have set up too few buffers for your partitions. Type the command addbuffer in a cli/shell to know how much buffers you have for all your partitions. Where have you find this value of 64 for the buffers of each partition ?

    I have searched on obligement.free.fr by typing 'installation morphos' and here are the results with differents versions of morphos. At the beginnings of morphos 1.4.x with scsciconfig the buffers setup was 600 for each partition. With morphos 2.0 this value was lowered to 300 for each partition. On the article morphos 2.6/2.7 as 2.x/3.x the value is the same, 300. On most recent articles about morphos 3.0/3.9 and 3.10/3.12 the value indicated is lowered to 128 but on grabbed pictures the value is steel 300.

    By tries increase the buffers value for each partition to 128 or 300 and verify how better the datas throughput are. This will take a few more memory but if the transferts are better it is not a problem.

    Brumiga


    Not I have set this up but MOS has set this up. I said "create a new partition" and MOS set all the values. I must expect that MOS knows right what the correct values are becuase it does all the detection and preparation, how can a user know this and if they are different then MOS has to inform the user about the right settings.
    The value for the buffer is written in HDConfig if you click on the partition.
    With addbuffers it shows that every partition has 128 buffers. Only the IceFS partitions say "unknown DOS packet request type".
    I Installed MorphOS with 3.10. I added all buffers to 300 now. With a large file I get almost 4MB/s. Still very low. So there must be nother reason.
  • »22.05.20 - 14:10
    Profile
  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    kas1e
    Posts: 97 from 2005/10/31
    Was anybody lucky enough to boot from sii1414 directly? I just created FFS based boot partition, put the necessary stuff in, and when I come to OF and type "show-devs" I have together with others:

    Quote:


    /pci@80000000/raid@5



    If i "cd" to "/pci/raid" and do ".properties" i have:

    Quote:


    vendor-id 0x1095 (4245)
    device-id 0x3114 (12564)
    revision-id 0x2 (2)
    class-code 0x10400 (66560)
    subsystem-id 0x1095 (4245)
    subsystem-vendor-id 0x7114 (28948)
    .vendor-name "Silicon Image"
    .class "Mass Storage Controller"
    .subclass "RAID"
    interrupts 0x1 (1)
    devsel-speed 0x1 (1)
    66mhz-capable
    fast-back-to-back
    min-grant 0x0 (0)
    max-latency 0x0 (0)
    name "raid"
    reg 5:0
    i5,0,10,0:8
    i5,0,14,0:4
    i5,0,18,0:8
    i5,0,1C,0:4
    i5,0,20,0:10
    m5,0,24,0:400
    m5,0,30,0:80000
    assigned-addresses i5,0,10,FE001030:8
    i5,0,14,FE001038:4
    i5,0,18,FE001100:8
    i5,0,1C,FE00103C:4
    i5,0,20,FE001110:10
    m5,0,24,80000800:400
    m5,0,30,80080000:80000



    But how to boot from?
  • »01.01.21 - 19:39
    Profile
  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Cego
    Posts: 711 from 2006/5/28
    From: Germany
    regarding CPU overclock. Is it possible to change the G4 on the CPU card for a higher clocked model? Don't know if they're pin compatible with newer versions.
    Pegasos II G4 @1.0GHz, 1GB DDR Ram, Radeon 9200Pro, 240GB SSD+160GB HD, MorphOS 3.18, AmigaOS4.1 FE, Debian 8
  • »01.01.21 - 20:17
    Profile
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12073 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Is it possible to change the G4 on the CPU card for a higher clocked
    > model? Don't know if they're pin compatible with newer versions.

    There's been some discussion on MPC7447A and MPC7448 and their pin compatibility with MPC7447 some years ago:

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=2&topic_id=6252&start=50

    Even if the 7447 could be replaced by a successor part in terms of pin compatibility (which has so far not been definitely answered), there're still the potential issues of SmartFirmware compatibility and cooling.
  • »02.01.21 - 00:59
    Profile
  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    kas1e
    Posts: 97 from 2005/10/31
    @All
    By the way, is anyone know where to check what kind of UHCI controller chip exactly pegasos2 have ?

    [ Edited by kas1e 02.01.2021 - 12:39 ]
  • »02.01.21 - 13:39
    Profile
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12073 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > what kind of UHCI controller chip exactly pegasos2 have ?

    The Peg2's UHCI controller is not a dedicated chip but is inside the Via VT8231 southbridge chip.
  • »02.01.21 - 16:45
    Profile
  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    kas1e
    Posts: 97 from 2005/10/31
    > The Peg2's UHCI controller is not a dedicated chip but is inside the Via VT8231 southbridge chip.

    Checked in OF via the "cd /pci/usb" and then ".properties", saying not VT8231, but VT83C572.
  • »05.01.21 - 06:21
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    I can check it at home.
    But Pegasos2 have Via VT8231 southbridge with 4port (2x2) USB 1.1
    and Via VT83C572 is PCI to USB controller with (probably) 2port USB1.1
    Cannot be VT83C572 part or subset of VT8231?
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »05.01.21 - 07:42
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Now I see, it can be caused by identical DeviceID (3038h) of VT83C572 and USB controller of VT8231.
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »05.01.21 - 07:56
    Profile
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12073 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> ".properties", saying not VT8231, but VT83C572

    > Cannot be VT83C572 part or subset of VT8231?

    Yes, I think that the VT83C572 is the UHCI controller contained in the VT8231 southbridge chip. The VT83C572 is available as both a dedicated chip, a controller inside UHCI/EHCI USB2 chips (like VT6202) and a controller inside multi-function chips (like VT8231 southbridge).
  • »05.01.21 - 13:10
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Quote:

    sailor wrote:In theory - if you succeed to find (or make) some AGPx1->PCI riser ( something like reversed riser for efika) you can try PCI card in AGP slot - in such case it will have double speed - 66MHz ( compares to 33MHz of other PCI slots).


    Even unicorns occasionally appears...
    Here on ebay is exactly such adapter.

    adapter: AGP to 66MHz PCI or PCI-X Adapter
    author: einstein186
    description:
    This adapter allows the use of 66 MHz PCI or PCI-X cards in a 3.3V or Universal AGP.
    As AGP is only an extension to the 66 MHz PCI Revision 2.1 specification, it inlcudes almost all the funtionality of a 66MHz 3.3V PCI slot. But as AGP uses a different connector it is by default not possible to install high performance 66 MHz PCI or PCI-X adapters in the AGP. We have developed this adapter to allow the use of high speed interface cards like 66 MHz PCI or PCI-X Gigabit Ethernet and SATA adapters in headless systems. The adapter uses a 6 Layer PCB design according to the AGP specification. With the theoretical throughput of 266 MB/s this adapter allows unprecedented I/O bandwidth on AGP based systems.
    PCI cards relying on the LOCK signal, which is missing from the AGP, might not work properly with this adapter.
    You are buying directly from the creator of this product. Please get in touch, if you have any questions.

    So, we can experiment wit Pegasos 2 and PCI(e) cards...
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »04.04.23 - 07:30
    Profile
  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    polluks
    Posts: 779 from 2007/10/23
    From: Gelsenkirchen,...
    @sailor
    That sounds interesting, what graphics cards would you like to test?
    I suppose for Matrox Parhelia we have no drivers...

    [ Editiert durch polluks 05.04.2023 - 12:51 ]
    Pegasos II G4: MorphOS 3.9, Zalman M220W · iMac G5 12,1 17", MorphOS 3.18
    Power Mac G3: OSX 10.3 · PowerBook 5,8: OSX 10.5, MorphOS 3.18
  • »05.04.23 - 11:40
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    @polluks:
    Matrox Parhelia is nice card, but most probably not more powerful than Radeon 9800 PRO, which is now in my Pegasos 2. Not count the drivers ;-).

    But there are PCI HD cards - one of them (HD4350) works for me in 33 MHz PCI slot.
    - when bigfoot finishes new gfx drivers, these cards could be faster than 9800 PRO.

    Largest profit can be from testing PCIe cards. Like X1950 or HD Northern Islands. Maybe they will not works because of Smart firmware initialization behind the PCI-PCIe bridge - we will see.
    And second what could work very nice here is SiI SATA1 or Promise SATA2 cards. Promise SATA2 I tested some years before ( see first post ) and speed was limited by slow PCI 33 MHz slot.




    [ Edited by sailor 05.04.2023 - 15:18 ]
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »05.04.23 - 14:07
    Profile
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12073 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > there are PCI HD cards - one of them (HD4350) works for me in 33 MHz
    > PCI slot. [...] Largest profit can be from testing PCIe cards. Like X1950
    > or HD Northern Islands. Maybe they will not works because of Smart firmware
    > initialization behind the PCI-PCIe bridge - we will see.

    Wouldn't this be the same as with your PCI HD4350 where SmartFirmware doesn't work but MorphOS does? After all, it shouldn't matter whether the bridge is soldered on the graphics card itself or on an adapter the graphics card is installed to.
  • »05.04.23 - 20:55
    Profile
  • MorphOS Developer
    cyfm
    Posts: 537 from 2003/4/11
    From: Germany
    I doubt that an AGP to PCI to PCIe adapter will get you anywhere with a Pegasos2 speedwise. AFAIR, the Pegasos2 only gives you a PCI 66MHz slot with an AGP connector, that means that non of the additional AGP DMA transfers really work which are important to get any of the more recent (AGP) cards up to speed - if graphics acceleration works at all without proper DMA, that is ...
    Even if you can get any newer card to work somehow, don't expect that you reach any better performance from it which makes the whole setup kind of pointless IMHO.
  • »05.04.23 - 21:58
    Profile Visit Website
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Quote:

    cyfm wrote:
    ...which makes the whole setup kind of pointless IMHO.


    And this is exactly thing what should be tested.
    Look here - you have to translate from Czech language. Sam440ep-flex is now much better computer with PCIe R9 270X.

    Sam440ep-flex is similar case like Pegasos2 - AMCC440ep has only PCI controller ( this time with PCI connector ), exactly as Marvell Discovery 2 in Pegasos 2 ( that one with AGP connector ). Both controllers has 66 MHz.
    Moreover - Sam shares 66 MHz PCI bus with SATA driver and bridge with slow devices. Pegasos 2 has 66 MHz bus dedicated for gfx, with own Hostbridge.

    If you take a look on article above, you see that bus speed ( write to VRAM ) with PCI-PCIe bridge is much slower ( latency from pcie reverse bridge ) than classic PCI/AGP cards. Despite this disadvantage, pcie cards are better.

    Such thing cannot be exactly theoretically calculated - they should be tested in real conditions. And of course, it also much depends on drivers - PCIe cards are much more powerfull, but drivers should utilize them.
    Thus I am looking forward to bigfoot's great work.




    [ Edited by sailor 06.04.2023 - 08:36 ]
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »06.04.23 - 07:25
    Profile
  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    sailor
    Posts: 358 from 2019/5/9
    From: Central Bohemi...
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    Wouldn't this be the same as with your PCI HD4350 where SmartFirmware doesn't work but MorphOS does? After all, it shouldn't matter whether the bridge is soldered on the graphics card itself or on an adapter the graphics card is installed to.


    It will be great. if yes. ;-) I agree with you that it should be this way.

    But we will see - PCI HD4350 has incorporated PCI-PCIe bridge 8111 ( or 8112 ) on card. It works.
    If I tested these times another real PCIe card ( I forgot the type) with external bridge 8111, it not worked.

    So chance there is, we will see.


    [ Edited by sailor 06.04.2023 - 09:21 ]
    AmigaOS3: Amiga 1200
    AmigaOS4: Micro A1-C, AmigaOne XE, Pegasos II, Sam440ep, Sam440ep-flex, AmigaOneX1000
    MorphOS: Efika 5200b, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, Powerbook G4, Mac Mini, iMac G5, Powermac G5 Quad
  • »06.04.23 - 08:20
    Profile