Which Isochronous audio devices tested OK on v3.10
  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1014 from 2013/5/24
    From: Englistan
    Quote:

    takemehomegrandma wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    I still have troubled think of USB as a "high end" solution.


    It goes all the way up to studio quality.


    It does indeed and I have several studio quality USB audio interfaces but I doubt a single one of them will work with MorphOS. Generally only the cheap crappy home use ones are class compliant.
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.9

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, OSX 10.5.8, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »08.04.18 - 16:34
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    r-tea
    Posts: 291 from 2005/3/27
    From: Poland, Zdzies...
    PlayStation Wireless Stereo Headset works fully and w/o any problem.
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  • »08.04.18 - 20:23
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9963 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > It would indeed appear that the PCIe x1 bridging issue still exists in MorphOS 3.10.

    That‘s unfortunate, especially for Sam460cr users. Thanks for testing.
  • »09.04.18 - 10:06
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4695 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    Quote:

    takemehomegrandma wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    I still have troubled think of USB as a "high end" solution.


    It goes all the way up to studio quality.


    It does indeed and I have several studio quality USB audio interfaces but I doubt a single one of them will work with MorphOS. Generally only the cheap crappy home use ones are class compliant.



    Well, if each one will only work with an OS dependant custom class, I can't see how that is our developer's collect fault.
    Maybe if you guys could focus on one or two of these "high end" "studio quality" usb audio interfaces, pay for one or two of each, and even consider a bounty for the software development...

    I know that might not sit well with some of you, but those of you that already had license keys got this upgrade for free.

    And lack of support for devices that require customized software (possibly proprietary)to work with a standard interface?
    It sounds like a lot of work for a small audience.

    Also the "crappy" home oriented devices will provide audio for systems lacking it.

    Then there is the other option. If you have the device, since the USB driver works, dig out your developer software and figure out how to write the missing part that will let your device use it.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »09.04.18 - 11:43
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  • MorphOS Developer
    jacadcaps
    Posts: 1677 from 2003/3/5
    From: Poland
    If there is going to be a HCL for USB Audio devices, it needs to be compiled by the users.
  • »09.04.18 - 12:45
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1014 from 2013/5/24
    From: Englistan
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    Quote:

    takemehomegrandma wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    I still have troubled think of USB as a "high end" solution.


    It goes all the way up to studio quality.


    It does indeed and I have several studio quality USB audio interfaces but I doubt a single one of them will work with MorphOS. Generally only the cheap crappy home use ones are class compliant.



    Well, if each one will only work with an OS dependant custom class, I can't see how that is our developer's collect fault.
    Maybe if you guys could focus on one or two of these "high end" "studio quality" usb audio interfaces, pay for one or two of each, and even consider a bounty for the software development...

    I know that might not sit well with some of you, but those of you that already had license keys got this upgrade for free.

    And lack of support for devices that require customized software (possibly proprietary)to work with a standard interface?
    It sounds like a lot of work for a small audience.

    Also the "crappy" home oriented devices will provide audio for systems lacking it.

    Then there is the other option. If you have the device, since the USB driver works, dig out your developer software and figure out how to write the missing part that will let your device use it.



    Why the feck would I want to plug my very expensive studio equipment into a MorphOS machine?
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.9

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, OSX 10.5.8, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »09.04.18 - 16:49
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    clr666
    Posts: 83 from 2008/7/8
    From: Russia
    Nope, Razer Megalodon 7.1 headphones don't appear in audio settings. But in usb stack looks assigned on class.
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  • »09.04.18 - 16:57
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  • MorphOS Developer
    jacadcaps
    Posts: 1677 from 2003/3/5
    From: Poland
    Quote:

    clr666 wrote:
    Nope, Razer Megalodon 7.1 headphones don't appear in audio settings. But in usb stack looks assigned on class.


    Did you boot with them connected?
  • »09.04.18 - 17:29
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    clr666
    Posts: 83 from 2008/7/8
    From: Russia
    Quote:

    jacadcaps wrote:
    Did you boot with them connected?


    Yes.
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  • »09.04.18 - 18:26
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4695 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    jacadcaps wrote:
    If there is going to be a HCL for USB Audio devices, it needs to be compiled by the users.


    Thanks Jacek, makes sense to me. Reminds me of a sale I made on eBay about a decade ago to German Linux enthusiast for a Creative Labs DXR3 decoder board.
    When I informed him there weren't any Linux drivers, he replied back "It's OK, send it anyway, I'll write one myself".

    Got to remember guys, this isn't a commercial OS (even if there is a license fee, there is no company or corporate backing).
    Its a hacker oriented OS primarily aimed at those who miss the alternative platforms.

    Got a piece of hardware that might not be supported because it requires specific software and the manufacturer does not find your market significant enough to invest development in?

    "...I'll write one myself".
    Gotta love the European hacking community.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »09.04.18 - 19:21
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4695 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:

    Why the feck would I want to plug my very expensive studio equipment into a MorphOS machine?


    Because you can. Does anything an Amiga (or are we still trying to distance ourselves from that "cursed" name) enthusiast do have to make good economic sense?

    Why do I want to use a video card in my G5 that costs more than the G5?
    Because it can be done.

    Why did we go to the moon?
    Because we could.

    Exploration (hey, and maybe killing a few natives), Europe ought to understand that idea. Its how you helped found my country.

    And no, there are no natives on the moon (I just had to prevent that inevitable comment).
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »09.04.18 - 19:28
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1014 from 2013/5/24
    From: Englistan
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:

    Why the feck would I want to plug my very expensive studio equipment into a MorphOS machine?


    Because you can. Does anything an Amiga (or are we still trying to distance ourselves from that "cursed" name) enthusiast do have to make good economic sense?

    Why do I want to use a video card in my G5 that costs more than the G5?
    Because it can be done.

    Why did we go to the moon?
    Because we could.

    Exploration (hey, and maybe killing a few natives), Europe ought to understand that idea. Its how you helped found my country.

    And no, there are no natives on the moon (I just had to prevent that inevitable comment).




    There's literally no software available that could make use of this type of hardware Jim, even if drivers got written. And if there were, I wouldn't use it on an os with no memory protection.

    Different tools for different jobs, MorphOS isn't suitable for everything.
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.9

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, OSX 10.5.8, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »09.04.18 - 20:03
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    ThePlayer
    Posts: 1024 from 2003/3/24
    From: Hamburg/Germany
    This conversation is very tiresome.
    Could we do something more constructive with this thread and start testing devices that do or don't work!?!
    i for one listen to music with my USB Headphones Creativ Fatal1ty HS800 writing this.
    They do work but the volume rocker that is part of the Headphones doesn't.

    [ Editiert durch ThePlayer 09.04.2018 - 22:53 ]
    PowerBook 17" SuperHD-Display MOD 1920x1200 :)
  • »09.04.18 - 21:03
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4695 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:

    Why the feck would I want to plug my very expensive studio equipment into a MorphOS machine?


    Because you can. Does anything an Amiga (or are we still trying to distance ourselves from that "cursed" name) enthusiast do have to make good economic sense?

    Why do I want to use a video card in my G5 that costs more than the G5?
    Because it can be done.

    Why did we go to the moon?
    Because we could.

    Exploration (hey, and maybe killing a few natives), Europe ought to understand that idea. Its how you helped found my country.

    And no, there are no natives on the moon (I just had to prevent that inevitable comment).




    There's literally no software available that could make use of this type of hardware Jim, even if drivers got written. And if there were, I wouldn't use it on an os with no memory protection.

    Different tools for different jobs, MorphOS isn't suitable for everything.



    Yeah, I don't get the lack of memory protection, but I'm sure it's a legacy Amiga thing.
    Even though software memory protection can fail, it worked reasonably well even on the 68K.
    Then again, I was using an OS that required position independent code and writing into an incorrect memory area is a little harder with you have that and a micro kernel based memory mapper.

    Still, we're not getting that until a shift to X64, if then.
    So be it.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »09.04.18 - 21:14
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4695 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    ThePlayer wrote:
    This conversation is very tiresome.
    Could we do something more constructive with this thread and start testing devices that do or don't work!?!
    i for one listen to music with my USB Headphones Creativ Fatal1ty HS800 writing this.
    They do work but the volume rocker that is part of the Headphones. So i have a fixed volume.


    Bummer, and I apologize for throwing off the thread.
    That sounds like an issue that might be addressed easier than one that requires a custom class.
    Care to bet it eventually gets resolved?
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »09.04.18 - 21:18
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    pegasos-sigi2
    Posts: 264 from 2006/8/31
    I test the hardware: "Speedlink SL-8850" Ultra Portable USB Audio Card. This works with MorphOS 3.10.
    Spreedy - The spreedsheet editor of MorphOS
    Calimero - Do you know about the new DTP Program for MorphOS ?
  • »10.04.18 - 13:34
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    deka
    Posts: 129 from 2013/2/12
    From: Hungary, Kecsk...
    We should collect these experiences in a document or webpage.
  • »10.04.18 - 14:51
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    maurensen
    Posts: 348 from 2003/10/3
    From: Padova - Italy
    Don't want tom hijack the thread but what's the best setting in AHI prefs to play via usb dac? Setting only unit 0 or all AHI units? Or it's no difference? Thanx in advance.
    -------------------
  • »10.04.18 - 15:37
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4695 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    maurensen wrote:
    Don't want tom hijack the thread but what's the best setting in AHI prefs to play via usb dac? Setting only unit 0 or all AHI units? Or it's no difference? Thanx in advance.


    No...valid question.
    And I like the idea of everyone hashing this out.

    Its just new territory that will have to be explored.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »10.04.18 - 19:26
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    realstar
    Posts: 286 from 2003/2/24
    From: Canada
    I ordered a Behringer uca202 for vinyl recording. Hopefully it will work as it doesn’t require drivers on other systems and it’s fairly simple with 1 pair of inputs/outputs. Should get it by Friday and I will report my results.
  • »10.04.18 - 21:10
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  • MorphOS Developer
    jacadcaps
    Posts: 1677 from 2003/3/5
    From: Poland
    So I did a quick test of my Burr-Brown HM-101. Audio output works, but there is no volume control. Mind that this device simply does not have volume controls - it expects the driver to do volume controls in software. This is something we do not currently do.

    Please mind that under Mac OS X this device also has no volume controls - it's always at max output.
  • »12.04.18 - 02:24
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    NewSense
    Posts: 685 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, UK...
    I actually re-installed v3.10, to see if this would resolve any/all of the issues I have encountered with v3.10 - no such luck. :-(

    Anyway, I selected my C-Media headphone/microphone USB hardware, which was listed in the AHI prefs, both before I re-installed and since. I then plugged in some powered 3.5mm jack speakers but no sound came out of them when I played some music with Jukebox, but when I ran a video file in MPlayer the sound came out of the speakers. However, the video file did not come out of my sound system for the rest of MorphOS - but the music via Jukebox came out as usual, but with no additional audio from the MPlayer video file. The only audio that came from the C-Media USB hardware/speakers was the video file audio, nothing from Jukebox/System sounds, and as others have said - no volume control, which seems a little ridiculous.

    So I chose the C-Media USB hardware to also be the main Music Unit, to see if the music from Jukebox would play on my speakers, and saved the settings.

    Then I re-booted, and the machine wouldn't start, it got to the boot screen, but no further. I tried this several times, but it wouldn't go any further.

    So I disconnected the C-Media USB hardware, and the system booted, basically as normal, then I changed the AHI options to use ONLY the built-in audio.

    I do not intend to re-test the Isochronous implementation again, until there is a fix for this and the other issues that seem to be plaguing it at this stage.

    Why was this Isochronous implementation released in such a state, surely it needs so much more testing and fixing that it was not worth including with v3.10 in this current state. I think v3.10 will go down as the worst release so far in the history of v3.x of MorphOS, IMHO.
    MacMini 1.5GHz,Model 10.2,64MB VRAM,250GB HDD,1GB RAM,Airport, Bluetooth,A1016 Keyboard,T-RB22 Mouse,DVD-RW-DL+CD-RW,Iomega MiniMax,Belkin 6 port 3 x Firewire/3 x USB2,MorphOS 3.11,Mac OSX 10.4/10.5,A1138+A1139 PwrBk MOS v3.11,Model 5,8/5,9
  • »12.04.18 - 05:21
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    polluks
    Posts: 395 from 2007/10/23
    From: Gelsenkirchen,...
    5.1 headphone: "Speedlink Medusa NX" works, also its remote control.
    Pegasos II G4: MorphOS 3.9, Zalman M220W
    Power Mac G3: OSX 10.3 · PowerBook 5,8: OSX 10.5, MorphOS 3.11
  • »12.04.18 - 06:08
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    deka
    Posts: 129 from 2013/2/12
    From: Hungary, Kecsk...
    I have made some experiments with USB sound devices on my Powerbook (A1138), since I received a LogiLink one at my workplace for Web meetings.

    The result is:
    - The device is recognized, appears in the Audio menu though most of the controlls are disabled. (Except Sample rate and Volume)
    - I set it as the default device, but there is no sound by trying to play some music with Jukebox/Ambient's built in player.
    - Trying with Aminet Radio (selected the card in the audio settings) made the miracle: The music was coming from this device. The volume could control only with Aminet Radio. The system volume control made nothing (even if this device was the default).

    After failing with the USB device, I was fooling around further with the built-in audio on my Powerbook.
    Tried to use an older pice of recording software, and also the new recorder tool.
    Finally, only the new tool could make a recording in the case if one of the AppleI2S... AHI devices was selected. The internal microphone's signal was recorded. If the music playing was ongoing, the recorder couldn't allocate AHI device.
    The other tool could do almost everything, but the created .wav file was not playable. Also monitoring wasn't worked.

    Some questions arise while experimenting:
    - What is Unit0 exactly, and What is the difference between Unit0 and AppleI2s... devices.
    - What is the difference between ++, Hifi and normal devices.

    Questions to the MOS devs:
    - Two tools can open simultaneously AHI for playing (also works fine), but the recorder can't allocate AHI, if a music playing is ongoing. Is it a shortcoming of AHI?
    - Do you plan to support the Powerbook's line-in?
    - What are the biggest problems with AHI?
    - IS it possible to record and play audio at the same time now?
  • »12.04.18 - 11:50
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9963 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > no sound came out of them when I played some music with Jukebox, but when
    > I ran a video file in MPlayer the sound came out of the speakers. However, the
    > video file did not come out of my sound system for the rest of MorphOS - but
    > the music via Jukebox came out as usual, but with no additional audio from the
    > MPlayer video file. The only audio that came from the C-Media USB hardware/
    > speakers was the video file audio, nothing from Jukebox/System sounds

    I'm not sure I'm able to follow this explanation, but this might be a case for redirecting the AHI music unit.
  • »12.04.18 - 12:10
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