Hyperion's assets
  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    OK...this is going to sound a little weird, but something occurred to me this weekend, so I thought I'd post it to you guys for feedback.
    Recently there have been some that have mentioned that it would be in OS4's best interests if the rights to the property were transferred to Aeon.
    Now we have no vested interest in this OS, but think about that for a moment.
    Aeon distributes through AmigaKit, and were OS4 to be exclusive to Aeon, its likely that distribution would be relegated to AmigaKit.
    Also, platforms not produced or supported by Aeon, might not be considered as candidates for porting.
    It doesn't sound like a big deal, but that might cut out the T2080 laptop project and could threaten anything Acube (or anyone else) might want to do independent of Aeon or AmigKit.
    And considering that Timothy De Groote is aware of the laptop project and is open to discussing a port is significant.

    There is the argument that Aeon's control of AOS would allow for more rapid development. I do not know that that is a given, but its not our concern. Nor would impeding OS4 development be in our favor, as the competition tends to spur us both forward. So...development issues aside...

    But, do we really want control of the market to be centralized around Aeon and AmigaKit, or would it be better for all variants of Amiga if there was a multiplicity of players?

    Personally, I'm changing my stance on this one.
    I support the status quo, which in a weird way, I guess means I support Hyperion.
    Doesn't mean I'm any bigger a fan of Ben Herman's.
    I just think that a broader effort benefits us all.

    And, if the bug bit me, and I got the urge to buy a copy of OS4, I wouldn't want to have to wait to have it shipped from England.
    Plus, if I had hardware I'd like to see supported by more than one NG OS, I don't think I'd like to have to approach a company with a vested interest in preventing hardware competition for a port of OS4.

    So...your input?
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »29.05.17 - 17:42
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    Kronos
    Posts: 1661 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    So...your input?


    Another 30 minutes of your life you'll never get back.
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »29.05.17 - 18:05
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    So...your input?


    Another 30 minutes of your life you'll never get back.


    Nah, I can rant quicker than that.
    More like 10 minutes of your life you can't get back, for having read that. ;-)

    AND, I can multitask.
    I've been playing around with a "new" OS/2 distro this weekend AND studying for a math test I have tomorrow night. ;-)

    Plus, Mark warned me before the weekend to be stocked up on popcorn.
    I doubt he's that clairvoyant, but it was timely advice.
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »29.05.17 - 18:13
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    takemehomegrandma
    Posts: 2393 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    Recently there have been some that have mentioned that it would be in OS4's best interests if the rights to the property were transferred to Aeon.

    So...your input?


    Cloanto owns the copyright to the OS which has been used to build OS4. They will most certainly own the trademark soon as well.

    There is currently a war going on between Hyperion and Cloanto. When that is over, and when the dust settles, a new situation will become visible.

    Some (much?) of the IP on top of 3.1 that constitutes "OS4" is probably owned by unpaid developers, let's call them "those who currently take care of the operating system" (Hyperion is merely a Publisher). Olaf Barthel recently explained his view that "the Amiga as a hobby, and as something to care for, went wrong, and this cannot and should not stand" (AmigaInc & Hyperion nightmare). He suggests approaching "those who currently take care of the operating system" and present a future plan, a future they can buy into and accept. On a very long term, his vision for a sustainable long time perspective is Open Source.

    Cloanto has approached developers directly before. Establishing copyright licenses directly with individual developers was how they managed to circumvent the legal/license nightmare situation concerning H&P's 3.9 and scavage what is now their Workbench 3.X product (their take on 3.9+).

    I think this is what he is hoping for. But for OS4 this time.

    AeonKit?! They don't fit the picture. They are not involved. They are merely someone pushing poor performance HW based on a dead-end CPU that noone can afford, they are a parenthesis, not anything "future".

    You will find Olaf "Olsen" Barthel's opinions expressed in the interesting Interview: Timothy De Groote - Director Hyperion Entertainment CVBA thread.
    MorphOS is Amiga done right! :-)
    MorphOS NG will be AROS done right! :-)
  • »29.05.17 - 18:57
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Thanks grandma,
    I'm not too keen on letting Matt handle everything, myself.
    And I have a copy of Amiga Forever.

    I don't care where this lands, as long as it isn't some weird closed universe like Apple.

    I missed Olaf's comments, I'll double check the article.

    Either way, this vision of a "One company to rule them all" thing has put me off.

    And I feel more comfortable than ever right where I am.
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »29.05.17 - 19:03
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    TheMagicM
    Posts: 1097 from 2003/6/17
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:


    So...your input?


    I dont care.

    [ Edited by TheMagicM 29.05.2017 - 15:16 ]
  • »29.05.17 - 21:16
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Cego
    Posts: 540 from 2006/5/28
    From: Germany
    when's MorphOS 3.10 coming?
    Powerbook G4@1,67GHz, 2GB DDR2 Ram, Radeon 9700, 60GB SSD, MorphOS 3.7
    PowerMac Dual G5 @2.3GHz, 4GB DDR Ram, Radeon 9600XT, 2x250GB HD, MorphOS 3.7, MacOS X Leopard 10.5.8
  • »29.05.17 - 21:41
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    TheMagicM
    Posts: 1097 from 2003/6/17
    Quote:

    Cego wrote:
    when's MorphOS 3.10 coming?


    Cego asking the important questions. :-)
  • »29.05.17 - 21:43
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    NewSense
    Posts: 512 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, Gr...
    I agree, but the release of 3.10 is getting more like the movie(s) 3:10 to Yuma - very slow to get going. I want to be shouting Yippee in the sunshine, not kept sat here in the dark, as in a cinema/movie theatre watching some boring film.
    Mac Mini 1.5GHz, Model 10.2, 64MB VRam, 250GB HDD, 1GB RAM, Airport, Bluetooth, Wireless Keyboard & Mouse, DVD-RW-DL+CD-RW, Iomega MiniMax, Belkin 6 port 3 x Firewire/3 x USB2, MorphOS 3.9, Mac OS X 10.4 & 10.5 & A1138 Powerbook MOS v3.9, Model 5,8
  • »29.05.17 - 22:16
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    TheMagicM wrote:
    Quote:

    Cego wrote:
    when's MorphOS 3.10 coming?


    Cego asking the important questions. :-)


    YES, that IS the question, isn't it?
    Looking forward to it.
    Will be installing on PowerMac G4, G5, iBook, and eventually X5000 (and I'd like a SAM460, but can't locate a listing for one).

    Another question is what will it bring us?

    X5000 support?
    New video drivers, sound drivers, features in general?

    BUT, here's how its always gone before...you wake up one day, check the sites, and its posted as available.
    Frustrating, isn't it? ;-)
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »29.05.17 - 22:18
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Cego
    Posts: 540 from 2006/5/28
    From: Germany
    i can tell you what its not going to bring: PowerMac G5 PCIe support. sadly as those machines are still quite robust compared to the older 7.3 models (two of mine already died)
    I'll install it on my PowerBook G4, which sadly got some faulty gfx mem probably. at least i get a totally trashed screen after 2-3 hours of usage.
    Powerbook G4@1,67GHz, 2GB DDR2 Ram, Radeon 9700, 60GB SSD, MorphOS 3.7
    PowerMac Dual G5 @2.3GHz, 4GB DDR Ram, Radeon 9600XT, 2x250GB HD, MorphOS 3.7, MacOS X Leopard 10.5.8
  • »29.05.17 - 22:47
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Cego wrote:
    i can tell you what its not going to bring: PowerMac G5 PCIe support. sadly as those machines are still quite robust compared to the older 7.3 models (two of mine already died)
    I'll install it on my PowerBook G4, which sadly got some faulty gfx mem probably. at least i get a totally trashed screen after 2-3 hours of usage.


    Uncool.
    Yeah, I'd like PCIe G5 support too, but I don't know if that will ever happen.
    I've got one here run Linux right now.
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »29.05.17 - 23:08
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Zylesea
    Posts: 1769 from 2003/6/4
    Quote:

    Jim schrieb:

    So...your input?


    As others said: I don't care. I am very glad MorphOS left all this Amiga darma behind. Yes, MorphOS has quite an Amiga heritage, but it isn't Amiga. It's MorphOS. hence ratherI don't care about Amiga nor about companies that make astronomical expensive hardware that get sold in homeopatic doses.

    MorphOS as it is runs fine, 3.10 (if it wil get ever released;-) )will make it even better. we have plenty ppc hardware that reached the top ppc can reach. And for the next decade MorphOS will eventually shift to x64. Pace colud be faster though, but let's keep it realistic. In 2020 we may have a first x64 release. Till about then the old apple kit will last.
    --
    http://www.via-altera.de

    Whenever you're sad just remember the world is 4.543 billion years old and you somehow managed to exist at the same time as David Bowie.
  • »29.05.17 - 23:10
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    amigadave
    Posts: 2440 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Shastina,...
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:
    BUT, here's how its always gone before...you wake up one day, check the sites, and its posted as available.
    Frustrating, isn't it? ;-)



    Not frustrating to me, but I guess some users get frustrated by the lack of timely updated news regarding when an OS is going to get a new version. 3.9 works well now, and I for one am not planning on purchasing an X5000, so the release of 3.10 is not that important to me. Sure, I would like to see it happen as soon as possible, to see what new features the Dev. Team has come up with, but using 3.9 now is satisfying my needs for MorphOS, and I don't mind not knowing an exact date when 3.10 will be released. At least we have some information about what 3.10 is going to have included in it, which is I think more than the users of AmigaOS4 get from Hyperion Entertainment. I'm completely in the dark about what is going on with OS4 development (if anything), and only A-Eon/AmigaKit seem to be making regular progress with their "Enhancer" software for OS4. How many years has Hyperion been working on AmigaOS4.2? Still no information on when it will be finished, or even any info that the features promised for 4.2 are being worked on by anyone.

    Hyperion is a joke, so I think that anyone other than them would be an improvement as the owner and developer of AmigaOS4. I disagree with TMHG, and don't think that Colanto has any interest in obtaining the rights to develop AmigaOS4 from Hyperion. I think that Colanto is doing quite well selling and doing small development improvements for AmigaOS3.x, and they don't need the headaches that come with AmigaOS4 development. After all, the market for AmigaOS3.x is still many times larger than the market for AmgiaOS4 and AmigaOne hardware. Colanto rightly realizes that there is also still value in the Amiga trademarks and copyrights, so they have been active in obtaining as many of them as they can, since Amiga Inc. is almost nonexistent, and Hyperion is mostly incompetent and unaware.

    I don't agree with Jim that having A-Eon/AmigaKit as the owner of the AmigaOS4 ip might be harmful for future development and diversity. Both companies have shown their support of all Amiga-Like platforms in the past, so I strongly doubt that they would make decisions in the future that would be harmful for any one platform, just to increase their support of AmigaOS4. I realize that there are many Amiga users out there that have developed a dislike for A-Eon/AmigaKit, believing that they are creating a monopoly of Amiga options, and are too interested in commercial success, instead of giving things away for free (which sadly is what too many users think should be the Amiga norm).

    I may not always agree with all of A-Eon/AmigaKit's decisions or marketing strategies, but I also don't think that either Matthew or Trevor have any ambitions that are harmful for the community. They are just two Amiga enthusiasts that are doing what they think is the best ways to grow and maintain our community, be their decisions right or wrong, from time to time.
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »29.05.17 - 23:26
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
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    Simon
    Posts: 809 from 2008/7/6
    From: Antwerp, Belgium
    Considering Amigakit suddenly became a reseller for APollo accelerators I wouldn't be suprised that at some point A-eon is going to produce 68k compatible fpga hardware at some point in cooperation with them pushing OS4 ( and MorphOS ) to the background. 68k fpga is THE hype for the moment in Amigaland and does hurt both PPC nextgen amiga flavors imho. Like it or not, interest is shifting away from both OS4 and MorphOS these days. They are in the same boat for now.

    So I kind of wonder where A-eon is going to be in let us say 5 years. Still producing hardware that only insane Amigans with either deep pockets buy ( or those that spend their last penny on it ) or go with the 68k flow or not bother anymore with OS4 or MorphOS.
    Proud member of the Belgian Amiga Club since 2003

  • »30.05.17 - 10:39
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  • Cocoon
    Cocoon
    terminills
    Posts: 54 from 2012/3/12
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    So...your input?


    Another 30 minutes of your life you'll never get back.



    +1
    :lol:
  • »30.05.17 - 11:39
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    terminills wrote:
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:

    So...your input?


    Another 30 minutes of your life you'll never get back.



    +1
    :lol:




    Actually...the losses seem to be mounting here. ;-)

    Quote:

    Simon wrote:...I kind of wonder where A-eon is going to be in let us say 5 years. Still producing hardware that only insane Amigans with either deep pockets buy ( or those that spend their last penny on it ) or go with the 68k flow or not bother anymore with OS4 or MorphOS.


    Well, in a few years we should have migrated to X64, plus there has to be a limit to how much of a market 68K based hardware can attract, after all its got performance limitations.

    Quote:

    amigadave wrote:...I don't agree with Jim that having A-Eon/AmigaKit as the owner of the AmigaOS4 ip might be harmful for future development and diversity. Both companies have shown their support of all Amiga-Like platforms in the past, so I strongly doubt that they would make decisions in the future that would be harmful for any one platform, just to increase their support of AmigaOS4. I realize that there are many Amiga users out there that have developed a dislike for A-Eon/AmigaKit, believing that they are creating a monopoly of Amiga options, and are too interested in commercial success, instead of giving things away for free (which sadly is what too many users think should be the Amiga norm).

    I may not always agree with all of A-Eon/AmigaKit's decisions or marketing strategies, but I also don't think that either Matthew or Trevor have any ambitions that are harmful for the community. They are just two Amiga enthusiasts that are doing what they think is the best ways to grow and maintain our community, be their decisions right or wrong, from time to time.


    Sorry for not addressing all of it David.
    Well folks, this is the well phrased, positive outlook on the situation.
    AND, Trevor has helped our developers obtain hardware.

    So, my posted concern could just be overblown paranoia based on AmigaKit poor support of its resellers (and I'm not going to refer to this as a strategy, Matt's service to US customers just isn't that good).

    But David is a better man than me (many of you are, that's why I listen to you)...so, the optimistic view. ;-)

    Hey, either way, we are not De Groot (that's supposed to be a bad pun, but it doesn't work for me either).

    [ Edited by Jim 30.05.2017 - 07:11 ]
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »30.05.17 - 11:44
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Sorry, duplicate post.
    Maybe I should have stuck to playing with ArcaOS, Eh?

    [ Edited by Jim 30.05.2017 - 07:13 ]
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »30.05.17 - 12:03
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9218 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Establishing copyright licenses directly with individual developers was how they
    > managed to circumvent the legal/license nightmare situation concerning H&P's 3.9

    Yes, that's exactly what Hyperion did :-)
  • »30.05.17 - 14:56
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9218 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > what will it bring us?

    Hopefully most things talked about there :-)
  • »30.05.17 - 15:14
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Jim
    Posts: 4134 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > Establishing copyright licenses directly with individual developers was how they
    > managed to circumvent the legal/license nightmare situation concerning H&P's 3.9

    Yes, that's exactly what Hyperion did :-)


    Scary, isn't it? At least it would be, if we were shareholders in this.
    Two companies, one with a (rather threadbare) claim to the right to develop from 3.1, the other (with probably not that much more validity) that claims ownership of the Amiga operating system.
    Both trying to license what they don't think they already have the rights to.
    And they both have filed for the copyrights (as has Matt @ AmigaKit).

    What a total flying fecal storm. ;-)

    Like I said before, Bigfoot urged me recently to stock up on popcorn (although that should be something everyone in the community should keep in stock).
    "Magnetic was troubled by my avatars and 'satanic' references" - Jim Igou

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »30.05.17 - 15:34
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9218 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > I disagree with TMHG, and don't think that Colanto has any interest
    > in obtaining the rights to develop AmigaOS4 from Hyperion.

    I'm not sure that's what takemehomegrandma thinks either.
  • »30.05.17 - 15:45
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 9218 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Both trying to license what they don't think they already have the rights to.

    What are Hyperion and Cloanto trying to license from whom?

    > And they both have filed for the copyrights (as has Matt @ AmigaKit).

    Which copyrights have Hyperion, Cloanto and AmigaKit filed for?
  • »30.05.17 - 16:01
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Simon
    Posts: 809 from 2008/7/6
    From: Antwerp, Belgium
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:
    Bigfoot urged me recently to stock up on popcorn (although that should be something everyone in the community should keep in stock).



    You should buy those small bags of corn to make the popcorn yourself. Much cheaper, healthier and it takes less space.

    Didn't know Amigakit was after whatever copyrights ? I did notice the new logo yesterday that looks a lot like the former Amiga Technologies one.
    Proud member of the Belgian Amiga Club since 2003

  • »30.05.17 - 16:08
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1097 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    There is currently a war going on between Hyperion and Cloanto. When that is over, and when the dust settles, a new situation will become visible.


    Gee, I was right once again. I said that was happening as soon as HYPErion started selling OS3.1 and a few high profile members here mocked the idea. It was pretty obvious though. Hopefully Cloanto takes HYPE to court and puts them out of business. Good riddance to bad rubbish.
  • »30.05.17 - 19:04
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