ARM for the future?
  • MorphOS Developer
    Henes
    Posts: 507 from 2003/6/14
    Quote:

    takemehomegrandma wrote:
    Maybe the focus of future MorphOS versions should be "Agnostic" rather than "x64"? Would put some demands on development environment etc to make a single source run on multiple platforms (like Linux). But maybe they are already going there?


    I think it was already mentioned several times that no architecture choice was ever made (beside PPC for current MorphOS). The OS should be written first...
  • »07.01.17 - 21:34
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > the CPU cores are modded ARM cores (IIRC A73s).

    I've never read or heard from a reliable source that cores which are created on the base of an ISA license (like Qualcomm's Kryo is) are modified ARM Ltd. cores. This doesn't sound plausible to me, even when the ISA licensee is a core licensee at the same time (like Qualcomm is).
  • »07.01.17 - 22:46
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1110 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > I think it's more likely that the 835 has added instructions that aid the software emulation

    Sounds unlikely to me. So far I've not seen or read any evidence in favour of that assumption.



    It's more likely than an on-die hardware emulation of an x86 CPU.
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.15

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »08.01.17 - 01:19
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  • Order of the Butterfly
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 215 from 2015/8/23
    Future version od morphos should be unix with amiga gui and graphics.
    Of course Future version od morphos should be cpu agnostic.
    After API change to not compatibile with old software, it is stupid to restrict morphos to particular cpu or motherboard.
  • »08.01.17 - 06:47
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>> I think it's more likely that the 835 has added instructions that aid the software emulation

    >> Sounds unlikely to me. So far I've not seen or read any evidence in favour of that
    >> assumption.

    > It's more likely than an on-die hardware emulation of an x86 CPU.

    ...but still less likely than there being neither "added instructions that aid the software emulation" nor "an on-die hardware emulation of an x86 CPU".
  • »08.01.17 - 10:44
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Future version od morphos should be cpu agnostic. [...] it is stupid to restrict morphos
    > to particular [...] motherboard.

    Ever heard of hardware drivers?
  • »08.01.17 - 10:54
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  • Order of the Butterfly
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 215 from 2015/8/23
    Hardware drivers will be easier to made if future mos will be based on unix.
  • »08.01.17 - 20:11
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  • Moderator
    Kronos
    Posts: 2243 from 2003/2/24
    Yeah and even more pointless as everybody will just USE "unix".


    MorphOS (and AmigaOS,RiscOS,BeOS) can only stay relevant as long as they don't turn into YALD.

    And yes for the general population BSDs are YALD.
  • »08.01.17 - 20:24
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4977 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    Yeah and even more pointless as everybody will just USE "unix".


    MorphOS (and AmigaOS,RiscOS,BeOS) can only stay relevant as long as they don't turn into YALD.

    And yes for the general population BSDs are YALD.


    UNIX, BSD (UNIX again), Linux (a kernel with UNIX pretensions), ALL closely related monolithic kernel based OS'.

    Not at all similar to Amiga related operating systems.
    Again (and again, and again...), if I freaking wanted to use a Linux like OS, I'd use one.
    If MorphOS was based on something like that, it would lose a lot of its appeal for me.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »08.01.17 - 21:07
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1110 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    ppcamiga1 wrote:
    Future version od morphos should be unix with amiga gui and graphics.



    What you want already exists https://www.aeros-os.org/

    Knock yourself out.
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.15

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »08.01.17 - 21:55
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    Zylesea
    Posts: 2053 from 2003/6/4
    Quote:

    Kronos schrieb:
    MorphOS (and AmigaOS,RiscOS,BeOS) can only stay relevant as long as they don't turn into YALD.



    Amen to that!
    --
    http://via.bckrs.de

    Whenever you're sad just remember the world is 4.543 billion years old and you somehow managed to exist at the same time as David Bowie.
    ...and Matthias , my friend - RIP
  • »08.01.17 - 22:28
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    Zylesea
    Posts: 2053 from 2003/6/4
    Quote:

    takemehomegrandma schrieb:
    The purpose of this thread has from the beginning been to try to predict how the ARM architecture is scaling upwards and growing into new markets, [constantly] a few years down the road.

    To summarize a bit:
    (...)


    While you may be right on your observation and prediction there is one thing to mind though which let me favour x64 pretty much. PCs are rather open, ARM designs usually are not. And this openess may be essential for a niche system that MorphOS is. And in contrast to ppc x64 will definitely not vanish too soon. I am sure in 20 years time it will still be possible to obtain an x64 system without much hassle - albeit it might have shifted into a comparatively small market (but it will not become a homeopathic market like for ppc).
    --
    http://via.bckrs.de

    Whenever you're sad just remember the world is 4.543 billion years old and you somehow managed to exist at the same time as David Bowie.
    ...and Matthias , my friend - RIP
  • »08.01.17 - 22:36
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    In_Correct
    Posts: 245 from 2012/10/14
    From: DFW, TX, USA
    71 posts so far, and I bet every one of those posts are demanding that MorphOS becoming Yet Another Linux Distribution.

    Samsung has released its own OS. Actually it is just Y.A.L.D.. That means that Samsung does not have its own OS. Neither does Google. Neither does MacBook.

    Also, I believe that RISC OS has attracted new developers, despite being original.

    Future MorphOS should place The Problem Software into The Emulator, until The Problem Software can be fixed.
    :-) I Support Quark Microkernel. :-D
  • »08.01.17 - 23:45
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    In_Correct
    Posts: 245 from 2012/10/14
    From: DFW, TX, USA
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > I think it was already mentioned several times that no architecture choice was ever made (beside PPC for current MorphOS). The OS should be written first...

    Bigfoot mentioned AMD64 a while back:

    http://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=11137&forum=11&start=6


    Does this mean that they are debating which ISA to use?
    :-) I Support Quark Microkernel. :-D
  • »08.01.17 - 23:46
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > 71 posts so far, and I bet every one of those posts are demanding that MorphOS
    > becoming Yet Another Linux Distribution.

    Half of them are about Vampire2/Apollo/68080 being slower than 68060 ;-)

    > Samsung has released its own OS.

    Their first version a few years ago, actually.
  • »09.01.17 - 01:07
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1110 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    In_Correct wrote:
    71 posts so far, and I bet every one of those posts are demanding that MorphOS becoming Yet Another Linux Distribution.

    Samsung has released its own OS kernel. Actually it is just Y.A.L.D.. That means that Samsung does not have its own OS. Neither does Google. Neither does MacBook.

    Also, I believe that RISC OS has attracted new developers, despite being original.

    Future MorphOS should place The Problem Software into The Emulator, until The Problem Software can be fixed.




    FTFY ;)
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.15

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »09.01.17 - 02:08
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Samsung has released its own OS kernel.

    Which one would that be?
  • »09.01.17 - 02:21
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 215 from 2015/8/23
    One of the major problems with morphos is porting software.

    It takes too much time and work.

    This problem should also be solved at the time of ISA switch.

    There is simple solution to problem with porting - future morphos should be amiga gui and graphics on unix.









    [ Edited by ppcamiga1 09.01.2017 - 15:17 ]
  • »09.01.17 - 16:17
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Jeckel
    Posts: 133 from 2007/3/11
    Quote:

    ppcamiga1 wrote:
    There is simple solution to problem with porting - future morphos should be amiga gui and graphics on unix.



    If it is actually the case, I'm out. :)
    If you want unix, just skin an existing one.
  • »09.01.17 - 16:31
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1110 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > Samsung has released its own OS kernel.

    Which one would that be?


    The Bada RTOS kernel.

    Bada could be run on top of a Linux kernel too but there are no devices in the wild that do AFAIK.
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.15

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »09.01.17 - 20:22
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > One of the major problems with morphos is porting software. It takes
    > too much time and work. [...] There is simple solution to problem with
    > porting - future morphos should be amiga gui and graphics on unix.

    Keeping Amiga GUI would mean no easier porting of software with GUI.
  • »09.01.17 - 23:59
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>> Samsung has released its own OS kernel.

    >> Which one would that be?

    > The Bada RTOS kernel. Bada could be run on top of a Linux kernel
    > too but there are no devices in the wild that do AFAIK.

    Thanks. Until now I wasn't aware of Bada's RTOS kernel.
  • »10.01.17 - 00:02
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  • Order of the Butterfly
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 215 from 2015/8/23
    Quote:

    Keeping Amiga GUI would mean no easier porting of software with GUI.


    We have qt port for amiga.
  • »10.01.17 - 04:10
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12086 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>> One of the major problems with morphos is porting software. It takes
    >>> too much time and work. [...] There is simple solution to problem with
    >>> porting - future morphos should be amiga gui and graphics on unix.

    >> Keeping Amiga GUI would mean no easier porting of software with GUI.

    > We have qt port for amiga.

    So Unix base isn't needed for this, obviously.
  • »10.01.17 - 05:40
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