X1000
  • Jim
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    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 4956 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Trust me, over night I had some chance to think over that post and it may be a little over the top.
    And I too have my own opinions about an ISA change, if one occurs.

    But for now, can't we just be grateful that we have gotten this far?

    And, to takemehomegrandma, if it appears that I have abused you too, my apologias.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »06.11.13 - 15:23
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    amigadave
    Posts: 2790 from 2006/3/21
    From: Northern Calif...
    Quote:

    takemehomegrandma wrote:
    ...also interesting to see that the "Cyrus" will *only* run the new SMP enabled kernel, and *not* the Amiga compatible one! :-o



    Where have you read that the "new SMP enabled kernel" will not be "Amiga compatible"?

    Other than several assumptions from people outside Hyperion about any kind of multi-processor, or multi-core support breaking Amiga compatibility, I have not seen any definitive statements from Hyperion that their proposed "SMP support" will break Amiga compatibility.

    I trust many of the people who have been saying that "True SMP" (what ever that really means), cannot be accomplished without breaking Amiga backward compatibility, we don't yet know what kind of SMP support Hyperion is going to implement, and therefore don't know if it will break Amiga backward compatibility (unless I missed some statement from them).

    The impression I have gotten from the statements I have read from Hyperion lead me to believe the way they are going to implement some kind of multi-processor/core support will NOT break backward Amiga compatibility, but as I wrote above, I have not seen anything from Hyperion that clearly states one way or the other about backward Amiga compatibility.

    [ Edited by amigadave 06.11.2013 - 13:53 ]
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »06.11.13 - 21:50
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > several assumptions from people outside Hyperion about any kind of multi-processor,
    > or multi-core support breaking Amiga compatibility

    Where have you seen those assumptions? I can only remember this being said about *symmetric* multiprocessing, and I think everybody has been in agreement that asymmetric multiprocessing won't break any compatibility.

    > we don't yet know what kind of SMP support Hyperion is going to implement

    What kinds of SMP support are there?
  • »06.11.13 - 22:44
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4956 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    I think it is a safe assumption that Steven Solie does not know the difference between SMP and ASMP.
    Also, MorphOS, just by the nature of being able to support boxed environments, is already better suited to either than AmigaOS.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »06.11.13 - 23:09
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > As yet no reply from Chris Rains to the e-mail I sent asking for clarification/update on the
    > status of my pre-order enquiry. [...] I strongly suspect either it was a prospective 'test'
    > of the potential market for such a product, or (more cynically) a tool to boost Servergy's
    > value on paper.

    "P-Cubed (PowerLinux Dev/Compute Node Board)" mentioned in a Freescale presentation from October (uploaded 3 weeks ago):

    http://www.freescale.com/files/training/doc/dwf/DWF13_M2M_IoT_SDN_SanJose.pdf (page 23)

    (...and also revealed there that the successor of the P4080-based CTS-1000 will be based on the T4240.*)


    * Edit:

    "The company is also giving the industry a sneak-peek of its 64-bit Cleantech I/O accelerator and server [...]. The new 64-bit system is currently under development and will be out later this year."
    http://servergy.com/servergy-gives-preview-of-worlds-densest-powerlinux-soc-server-at-ocp-summit/

    "CTS-64000"
    http://oracleus.activeevents.com/2014/connect/fileDownload/session/BD8C94DD27862557EA8B766C0F0B7BD9/CON5660_Beckwith-J1.pdf (10/2014, pages 50 to 56)

    http://www.infoq.com/articles/Hadoop-Cluster (12/2014)

    https://community.freescale.com/servlet/JiveServlet/previewBody/105848-102-1-27287/ftf-snt-f1205.pdf (06/2015, pages 33/34)

    [ Edited by Andreas_Wolf 14.07.2015 - 17:42 ]
  • »29.11.13 - 09:42
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4956 from 2009/1/28
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    >"(...and also revealed there that the successor of the P4080-based CTS-1000 will be based on the T4240.)"

    Now that is cool. 24 virtual cores!
    Our developers announce a future ISA change, and things keep happening in the PPC world.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »29.11.13 - 22:18
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> the successor of the P4080-based CTS-1000 will be based on the T4240

    > things keep happening in the PPC world.

    According to this article, the CTS-1000 is about 15,000 USD, so don't expect its successor to be any cheaper. But on the other hand, there is another T4240-based system going for less than a tenth:

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=7780&forum=11&start=34


    Edit: Massive price drop for the CTS-1000:

    "prices start at $1,000."
    http://servergy.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Servergy-CTS-QuadS-Flyer-11-10-14.pdf

    [ Edited by Andreas_Wolf 18.11.2014 - 12:09 ]
  • »29.11.13 - 23:06
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Posts: 316 from 2003/7/26
    From: Chicago, IL
    Will MorphOS run on the X4000?
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  • »12.12.13 - 09:35
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    itix
    Posts: 1516 from 2003/2/24
    From: Finland
    Quote:

    discreetfx wrote:
    Will MorphOS run on the X4000?


    What is that?
    1 + 1 = 3 with very large values of 1
  • »12.12.13 - 11:41
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> Will MorphOS run on the X4000?

    > What is that?

    Maybe this:

    "internally we are referring to [...] the P5040 model as the AmigaOne-X4000."
    http://obligement.free.fr/articles_traduction/itwdickinson2_en.php
  • »12.12.13 - 11:55
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  • Order of the Butterfly
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    tolkien
    Posts: 401 from 2013/5/29
    Would be great to support x4000 if MOS support multicore . If not I think its a expensive machine.
    MorphOS: PowerMac G5 - PowerBook G4 - MacMini.
    Classic: Amiga 1200/060 - A500 PiStorm
  • »12.12.13 - 13:04
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    Kronos
    Posts: 2047 from 2003/2/24
    There are allready plenty dual-CPU-setups (PMac G4 and G5) that are supported by MorphOS, so if adding SMP or AMP was the goal, one wouldn't need invest into overpriced deadend HW from AEON.
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »12.12.13 - 13:38
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    tolkien
    Posts: 401 from 2013/5/29
    Thats true. I have a dual g5 waiting to fly with morphos. The only problem is they are getting older. But hell, 3000 euros for a machine is too much.
    MorphOS: PowerMac G5 - PowerBook G4 - MacMini.
    Classic: Amiga 1200/060 - A500 PiStorm
  • »12.12.13 - 13:52
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1423 from 2003/4/13
    I'm not paying $3,000 for a machine that will still be slower than my PowerMac G5. The very idea is lunacy!!!
  • »12.12.13 - 23:47
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    Addendum:

    > http://www.ultra-electronics.com/press_releases/299_Ultra_acquires_Varisys_-June_2013.pdf
    > http://www.varisys.co.uk/news/varisys-ltd-acquired-by-ultra-electronics
    > http://www.a-eon.com/news/16-06-2013.html

    Also reflected on the new motherboard:

    http://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t1/156896_749481141728940_152014557_n.jpg

    And btw:
    http://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/t31/1836762_758264830850571_2054294710_o.jpg
    http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38719&forum=33#728708
  • »10.02.14 - 22:29
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  • Jim
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    Jim
    Posts: 4956 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    That is kind of neat.
    OK, so its an expensive, impractical vanity project for a small community.
    Who says hobbyist computing has to be practical?
    It is very much an Amiga spectrum device.

    Personally, I hope we keep developing the Abox based/PPC version of MorphOS moving forward (regardless of the ISA/64 bit move) and that the developers consider this platform (the X5000).
    It should way out perform the SAM460.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »10.02.14 - 22:36
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    In_Correct
    Posts: 245 from 2012/10/14
    From: DFW, TX, USA
    Quote:

    Jim wrote:
    That is kind of neat.
    OK, so its an expensive, impractical vanity project for a small community.
    Who says hobbyist computing has to be practical?
    It is very much an Amiga spectrum device.

    Personally, I hope we keep developing the Abox based/PPC version of MorphOS moving forward (regardless of the ISA/64 bit move) and that the developers consider this platform (the X5000).
    It should way out perform the SAM460.


    I agree. I can't remember if I have already said this:

    But I would love continued support of PowerPC device, even while supporting a second architecture. Support all available PowerPC, while selecting 2 - 4 x86 64 items: a desktop computer and laptop computer, each with a "low end" (affordable one) and a "media center" one.

    I do not believe there needs to be supporting more than four X86 64 items. It might increase User Base significantly, but it might not. According to Wikipedia, there are other Amiga "inspired" OSes, almost all on X86, yet none are more popular than MorphOS. (Or perhaps it is because these OSes are inferior compared to MorphOS.) However, if X86 64 support increases User Base by thousands of thousands, then perhaps they should support dozens or hundreds of X86 64.

    I do have one respectful disagreement. I do not think ABox should be supported. It should be moved to an emulator. Another idea: perhaps if MorphOS attempts SMP, then one core can be ABox and another core can be QBox. ?

    It would be nice for MorphOS to support the X5000, but also it would be nice if MorphOS to support the SAM 460. :-)
    :-) I Support Quark Microkernel. :-D
  • »21.04.14 - 15:51
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Support all available PowerPC

    This would dash against missing support for GPUs in machines where the GPU is onboard and you can't put in another one.

    > I do not think ABox should be supported. It should be moved to an emulator.

    On little-endian non-PPC, ABox couldn't be supported anyway. And on PPC, a box or virtual environment for ABox wouldn't be something I'd call an emulator.
  • »21.04.14 - 16:33
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11478 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > The T2080 looks like a good possible CPU for any PPC Amiga/Morph/AROS system,
    > if any kind of multi-processor support can be completed. The fact that it includes
    > Altivec is a plus.

    Prices for 1000 pcs. qty. revealed: 127 100...111 142 USD
    Reference design board T2080RDB is 1499 USD.

    http://www.freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=T2080&tab=Buy_Parametric_Tab
    http://www.freescale.com/files/32bit/doc/brochure/PWRARCHQIQSG.pdf (page 7)
    http://www.freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=T2080RDB
    http://www.freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=T2080RDB&tab=Buy_Parametric_Tab
    http://www.freescale.com/files/32bit/doc/fact_sheet/T2080RDBFS.pdf


    Edit: new chip prices

    [ Edited by Andreas_Wolf 06.11.2014 - 15:54 ]
  • »29.04.14 - 17:06
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    WB_Coder
    Posts: 66 from 2014/5/1
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    Reference design board T2080RDB is 1499 USD.

    http://www.freescale.com/webapp/sps/site/prod_summary.jsp?code=T2080&tab=Buy_Parametric_Tab
    http://www.freescale.com/files/32bit/doc/brochure/PWRARCHQIQSG.pdf (page 7)


    Am I reading the pdf correctly that the Eval board has 4 PCIe slots that are 2.0/3.0 Generation compatible?

    If the MorphOS Dev. Team would port to this Eval board, couldn't this board be used as the basis for a brand new MorphOS compatible computer system at a price of not much more than $2,000 US Dollars, or less if you use existing case and PSU and other peripherals that you already own?

    At 1.2GHz to 1.8GHz with Altivec, 8 cores, and 4 PCIe slots, as well as USB2.0/3.0 and Ethernet on board, I don't see why this wouldn't work. The 7 other cores would go to waste, but could be utilized if the owner also wanted to run Linux on the same box part of the time.

    Edit: We could use PCIe to PCI and/or AGP adapters for video and sound cards, until we could get drivers for
    PCIe cards, couldn't we? Just wondering if this could be the answer for users who want new equipment, instead of used Mac gear. That is not me, as I am satisfied with what we already have, but some are not.


    [ Edited by WB_Coder 04.06.2014 - 15:03 ]
    WB_Coder = Wanna Be Coder
  • »05.06.14 - 00:58
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    Kronos
    Posts: 2047 from 2003/2/24
    a) 2000$ is still far far to expensive to make any sense for what is essentially G4 class performance

    b) even if we could make good use of all cores (which we can't) it would still be a bad bang/back ratio

    c) getting PCIe GFX cards with allready supported GPUs is not a problem
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »05.06.14 - 03:39
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    In_Correct
    Posts: 245 from 2012/10/14
    From: DFW, TX, USA
    I would fear supporting that proposed computer could overwhelm MorphOS developers. Instead of jumping at multiple computers simultaneously, it should be taken one step (or computer) at a time. Example SAM 460, which unless something changed I am not aware of, it is a computer still in production, not an Apple, and is not expensive. If angry mobs demand X1000 etc. then I would certainly join the request to port MorphOS to the X1000s.
    :-) I Support Quark Microkernel. :-D
  • »05.06.14 - 03:55
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  • Butterfly
    Butterfly
    Britelite
    Posts: 66 from 2003/6/4
    From: Finland
    Quote:

    In_Correct wrote:
    ...and is not expensive.

    Well, I wouldn't call it cheap or even reasonably priced ;)
  • »05.06.14 - 05:14
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