Tabor
  • vox
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    vox
    Posts: 462 from 2003/11/25
    From: Belgrade
    Quote:

    ppcamiga1 wrote:
    Commodore sell Amiga 1200 BUNDLE called Magic Box with Personal Paint and WordWorth.
    Yes it is Commodore tradition.



    Yes, but they sold complete systems supported by OS, unlike AEON.
    Big diff. Never sold a "beta system", which is AEON tradition (x1000, x5000 and now A1222 launch with no finalized OS)

    Talking of which, Ethernet.device and OS 4.2 still being prepaid by x1000 users.
    ------------------------------------------
    x1000 user, ASAP Vampire Standalone user, future MOS user
    YT: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdHl_msNWHEVPf229h_gijQ
  • »24.12.19 - 18:08
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    Kronos
    Posts: 1982 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    vox wrote:


    Yes, but they sold complete systems supported by OS, unlike AEON.
    Big diff. Never sold a "beta system", which is AEON tradition (x1000, x5000 and now A1222 launch with no finalized OS)
    .


    Yeah, Amiga (later renamed Amiga1000) and the 3000D were just stories made up Atari !!!!!! !!
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »24.12.19 - 18:26
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 202 from 2015/8/23
    dear vox what you wrote is stupid.
    drivers for x1000 are avaible for years.
  • »24.12.19 - 19:06
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Jim
    Posts: 4897 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    ppcamiga1 wrote:
    dear vox what you wrote is stupid.
    drivers for x1000 are avaible for years.





    Not as stupid as promising OS 4.2 to users of a system no longer in production.
    Or promising it to anyone, for that matter, when Hyperion can't even finish a relatively simple port in a reasonable time frame.
    Yes, the choice of CPUs made it more problematic, but this stuff has dragged on for far too long.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »24.12.19 - 19:20
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 10976 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> Ethernet.device [...] still being prepaid by x1000 users.

    > drivers for x1000 are avaible for years.

    Not the driver for the Nemo on-board (or better: PA6T on-chip) GbE controller.
  • »24.12.19 - 22:12
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 10976 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Not as stupid as promising OS 4.2 to users of a system no longer in production.

    That promise preceded the production of the last X1000 batch by several years. Has it ever been reiterated since?
  • »24.12.19 - 22:18
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    amigadave
    Posts: 2706 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Arrowhead...
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > Not as stupid as promising OS 4.2 to users of a system no longer in production.

    That promise preceded the production of the last X1000 batch by several years. Has it ever been reiterated since?


    I think at this point in time, I would be glad to just get a perfectly working driver for the X1000's Nemo motherboard Ethernet controller, and forget about the promise for a free copy of AmigaOS4.2 (since we all know that it will never be completed as it was first described when advertising for the X1000 was going on). It would be nice to free up the slot taken by the current Ethernet card, but I understand why little or zero resources are being used to work on fixing the driver, as there are plenty of other projects to work on, and the X1000's onboard Ethernet controller is way down the list of priorities (if it is even on the list at all, at this point).

    I feel disappointed that more effort has not gone into supporting the X1000 owners, who were the people who were the first to step forward to support what Trevor and later Matthew were doing, and continue to attempt to do, which is trying to revive a mostly dead (AmigaOS4) niche community. Since they made the effort to make the X1000 and X5000 different than off the shelf hardware, by adding the Xorro slot and Xena chip, I think they surely should have put more, and at least SOME effort into porting the tools to develop software for it. A-Eon should have come out with at least one project that makes great use of that co-processor, maybe home automation, which was recently discussed on one of the forums, would be a great use?
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »25.12.19 - 01:12
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 202 from 2015/8/23
    Amiga X1000 has enough slots and network card based on 8139 chip cost about 5 E so it is not a problem.
  • »25.12.19 - 07:04
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    Kronos
    Posts: 1982 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    amigadave wrote:
    A-Eon should have come out with at least one project that makes great use of that co-processor, maybe home automation, which was recently discussed on one of the forums, would be a great use?



    Yeah, keep your 2000$ Amiga running 24/7 so can close/open your blinds!!

    Thats what rPI and suchlike are for, or if you really want to do it in an Amiga-way, take an Efika + some USB-dodat, relativly cheap small and low power.

    Thinking of this, Efika beat the 1st Pi to market by 5 years so this might have been something that could have sold quite few.
    Main stopping point (IMO) was the lack of low power onboard GFX.

    Xorro was a brainfart and so are all suggested use cases.
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »25.12.19 - 09:24
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  • vox
  • Order of the Butterfly
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    vox
    Posts: 462 from 2003/11/25
    From: Belgrade
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > Not as stupid as promising OS 4.2 to users of a system no longer in production.

    That promise preceded the production of the last X1000 batch by several years. Has it ever been reiterated since?


    No, it has been physically prepaid as extended license over normal OS 4.1 price,
    as well as in the manual.

    Never mentioned after x1000 launch and Amiwest 2016 or so.

    I will consider PA Semi Nemo supported once both cores, up to 8GB RAM, Onboard GB Ethernet is supported, as OS 4.2 promise is :) As well as pre 7000HD cards were promised to have old w3d, not nova. CFE is so buggy ... no words to describe.

    Never seen nice system with so little love by the makers.
    ------------------------------------------
    x1000 user, ASAP Vampire Standalone user, future MOS user
    YT: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdHl_msNWHEVPf229h_gijQ
  • »26.12.19 - 10:48
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  • vox
  • Order of the Butterfly
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    vox
    Posts: 462 from 2003/11/25
    From: Belgrade
    Quote:

    ppcamiga1 wrote:
    Amiga X1000 has enough slots and network card based on 8139 chip cost about 5 E so it is not a problem.



    Its 10x slower, occupies important PCI slot and why doubling function with weaker. Yes, x1000 can work with Radeon 9200, but that is not what it is made for with PCI-E lanes.

    No beta logic please, support "AmigaNG Dream machine", dont move to next system and do same evil.

    5e for you, find me and import one to non EU Candidate country. I can show you the end bill with p&p and all import fees and taxes.

    [ Edited by vox 26.12.2019 - 10:50 ]
    ------------------------------------------
    x1000 user, ASAP Vampire Standalone user, future MOS user
    YT: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdHl_msNWHEVPf229h_gijQ
  • »26.12.19 - 10:49
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 202 from 2015/8/23
    As I explained this in pm on aw earlier I prefer to spend little money to get working hardware and drivers instead of wasting time on pointless attacks on H&A.

    The problem is in way that You vox deal with problems. But it is Your problem.
  • »26.12.19 - 11:15
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    Spectre660
    Posts: 257 from 2015/6/30
    @Vox

    Under Amiga Os 4.1 pre 7000HD cards have neither old Warp3D nor Warp3D Nova.
    A-Eon tried Warp3D but could not get it to work. Hyperion apparently gave up on Gallium.
    Development was moving too slowly and it was eclipsed by A-Eon's Warp3DSI and then Warp3DNova

    The major current issue going forwards is that CFE does not (currently ?)support Polaris cards.(Lack of Polaris support is a BIG issue going forwards.)
    Polaris Cards have Warp3D Nova support but no current Warp3D support.
    A private project (Non A-Eon)to support old Warp3D via Warp3D Nova for both Radeon SI and Polaris ongoing .

    Tabor supports Polaris cards so watch out as "Big tings a come Rasta."


    The multicore support is being worked on so could happen at some point .
    I would assume that the use of the addition ram is also in the multicore framework .

    The saga with the X1000 onboard ethernet was aired publicly so no need to touch that.
    But could also happen at some point .
  • »26.12.19 - 12:41
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Jim
    Posts: 4897 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Spectre660 wrote:
    @Vox

    Under Amiga Os 4.1 pre 7000HD cards have neither old Warp3D nor Warp3D Nova.
    A-Eon tried Warp3D but could not get it to work. Hyperion apparently gave up on Gallium.
    Development was moving too slowly and it was eclipsed by A-Eon's Warp3DSI and then Warp3DNova

    The major current issue going forwards is that CFE does not (currently ?)support Polaris cards.(Lack of Polaris support is a BIG issue going forwards.)
    Polaris Cards have Warp3D Nova support but no current Warp3D support.
    A private project (Non A-Eon)to support old Warp3D via Warp3D Nova for both Radeon SI and Polaris ongoing .

    Tabor supports Polaris cards so watch out as "Big tings a come Rasta."


    The multicore support is being worked on so could happen at some point .
    I would assume that the use of the addition ram is also in the multicore framework .

    The saga with the X1000 onboard ethernet was aired publicly so no need to touch that.
    But could also happen at some point .


    I'd have to side with Vox on the opinion that a neat piece of NG hardware is being neglected.
    An Tabor is hardly an alternative, even if it can run with an RX640 video card.

    Then again, a thread on MorphZone focusing on the X1000 or Polaris video cards is in itself kind of pointless, as neither are supported by MorphOS.
    Although Polaris (and later cards) might eventually receive some driver love.

    Pity the X1000 won't receive a MorphOS port, but the limited size of that market doesn't help the argument in favor of it.

    And we can leave the Tabor platform to those who are willing to accept its compromises.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »26.12.19 - 17:35
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    Spectre660
    Posts: 257 from 2015/6/30
    @Jim

    Under AmigaOS 4.1 Polaris cards are going to bring some special love and BIG key enhancements.
    Game changing stuff .Tabor support included .
    Enhancer V2.0 coming soon.

    [ Edited by Spectre660 26.12.2019 - 12:54 ]
  • »26.12.19 - 17:50
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Jim
    Posts: 4897 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Spectre660 wrote:
    @Jim

    Under AmigaOS 4.1 Polaris cards are going to bring some special love and BIG key enhancements.
    Game changing stuff .Tabor support included .
    Enhancer V2.0 coming soon.


    But only for Tabor and X5000 platforms?
    Or can older systems like the SAM460 be updated?
    And we've ruled out the X1000 as its firmware makes it incompatible with Polaris?
    If is the case, why aren't any updates to that being considered?

    Or is Aeon following Apple's path of immediately obsoleting out of production hardware?
    Again, that would be a pity, as the X1000 never received the full support promised when it was introduced.

    Still, if Enhancer 2.0 works on an X5000, I can separate its utility from the necessity of buying Tabor.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »26.12.19 - 18:20
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    Spectre660
    Posts: 257 from 2015/6/30
    @Jim

    Sam460ex works with Polaris.
    Maybe a fluke that it does because the U-Boot version of the Sam460ex is old.
    The X5000 & Tabor have newer U-boot versions.

    It was stated a while ago that X1000 CFE was not under A-Eon's control.
    Don't know if they have made any progress on this.

    Enhancer includes the A-Eon drivers.
    These include the full Radeon HD driver and Enhancer V2.0 will include the
    Radeon Polaris driver.
    The current OS 4.1 FE CD or ISO only include a Lite version of the Radeon HD driver for example. This includes the Sam460ex CD .

    I would expect Tabor sound and Ethernet drivers to be on new AmigaOS 4.1 ISO's though .

    See this link re X1000 network story Quote below.


    https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=de&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://www.os4welt.de/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D28%26t%3D1670%26sid%3Dfc0204d4073af97d6ad5fb50dda6b1c4%26start%3D140&xid=17259,15700023,15700186,15700191,15700256,15700259,15700262,15700265,15700271,15700283&usg=ALkJrhh1f6VXLWoHl6Z7basDcS8xg7FxWg#p33185


    Quote:



    by Cyborg » March 22nd, 2018 10:09 am

    And X1000 runs completely out of competition anyway. There is not even a "contract" for this, but only a loose promise on my part that I could take a look at it, I would finally be given working hardware again and I would also have time for it. Back in 2012, the X1000 prototype provided broke in the middle of the driver's beta test. I sent it to A-EON and never got a replacement for it, although it was requested umpteen times. A-EON didn't feel responsible, neither did Hyperion. Without hardware, no driver. Then other people fooled around in my code and didn't do anything. Therefore, A-EON finally came back to me to see if I could not look at it and after several years I put up an X1000 again. It was also used for a lot of work on AmigaOS, but time for the unimportant anyway, since there are enough PCI slots, I haven't had any network drivers so far. See above.


    [ Edited by Spectre660 26.12.2019 - 14:08 ]
  • »26.12.19 - 18:47
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
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    Zylesea
    Posts: 1959 from 2003/6/4
    Quote:

    Spectre660 schrieb:

    Game changing stuff .Tabor support included .
    Enhancer V2.0 coming soon.

    [ Edited by Spectre660 26.12.2019 - 12:54 ]


    "Game changing" - you made me spitting the coffee over the screen and key board because of LOL.
    Cought in a atime capsule from one or two decades ago--?
    Funny! A classic. More of that, please!
    --
    http://www.via-altera.de

    Whenever you're sad just remember the world is 4.543 billion years old and you somehow managed to exist at the same time as David Bowie.
    ...and Matthias , my friend - RIP
  • »26.12.19 - 22:52
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  • rob
  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
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    rob
    Posts: 128 from 2008/7/22
    Quote:

    Zylesea wrote:
    Quote:

    Spectre660 schrieb:

    Game changing stuff .Tabor support included .
    Enhancer V2.0 coming soon.

    [ Edited by Spectre660 26.12.2019 - 12:54 ]


    "Game changing" - you made me spitting the coffee over the screen and key board because of LOL.
    Cought in a atime capsule from one or two decades ago--?
    Funny! A classic. More of that, please!


    I've seen a few hints including one from Trevor and if I've not misread the hints then there will certainly be something in Enhancer 2 that is a first for any Amigoid OS.
  • »26.12.19 - 23:13
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    amigadave
    Posts: 2706 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Arrowhead...
    Quote:

    Zylesea wrote:
    Quote:

    Spectre660 schrieb:

    Game changing stuff .Tabor support included .
    Enhancer V2.0 coming soon.

    [ Edited by Spectre660 26.12.2019 - 12:54 ]


    "Game changing" - you made me spitting the coffee over the screen and key board because of LOL.
    Cought in a atime capsule from one or two decades ago--?
    Funny! A classic. More of that, please!


    Well, to be honest, it wouldn't take much to make many AmigaOS4 users call something "game changing". Comparing it to mainstream, the change will probably be more like a minor step forward, toward bringing the graphics of AmigaOS4 closer to something like what is available on Linux.
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »26.12.19 - 23:38
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Zylesea
    Posts: 1959 from 2003/6/4
    I've seen many of that "hints" over the years by the OS4 crowd. The track record and pattern repetition is speaking for itself....
    --
    http://www.via-altera.de

    Whenever you're sad just remember the world is 4.543 billion years old and you somehow managed to exist at the same time as David Bowie.
    ...and Matthias , my friend - RIP
  • »26.12.19 - 23:49
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  • rob
  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
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    rob
    Posts: 128 from 2008/7/22
    Quote:

    Zylesea wrote:
    I've seen many of that "hints" over the years by the OS4 crowd. The track record and pattern repetition is speaking for itself....




    Hence my not stepping out on the line to express what I think may be being hinted at.
  • »27.12.19 - 00:29
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 10976 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>> Not as stupid as promising OS 4.2 to users of a system no longer in production.

    >> That promise preceded the production of the last X1000 batch by several years.
    >> Has it ever been reiterated since?

    > Never mentioned after x1000 launch and Amiwest 2016 or so.

    I don't understand. If it was mentioned the last time at AmiWest 2016 (or so) as you claim, it was necessarily mentioned after the X1000 launch.
  • »27.12.19 - 21:57
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 10976 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> network card based on 8139 chip cost about 5 E

    > Its 10x slower

    Not with ancient BSD core and abysmal SANA-II driver interface of OS4 TCP/IP stack ;-)
  • »27.12.19 - 22:23
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  • Order of the Butterfly
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    ppcamiga1
    Posts: 202 from 2015/8/23
    Quote:

    Zylesea wrote:
    I've seen many of that "hints" over the years by the OS4 crowd. The track record and pattern repetition is speaking for itself....



    Many dumb people in Amiga community think that if they make problems where no problems at all there will be switch from ppc.
    As long as AROS x86 or MOS x86 is not good enough to justify resignation from using windows it will not going to happen.
    You want to change to commodity hardware You have to provide Amiga solution that is as good as win/osx/lnx ,maybe 10 % worse but no more.
    Otherwise it still will be a hobby, and as a hobby ppc is more interesting.


    [ Edited by ppcamiga1 28.12.2019 - 08:50 ]
  • »28.12.19 - 09:49
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