.,.

[ Edited by Kokos 19.12.2017 - 07:52 ]

A really interesting bounty.
I also thought about it some time ago. Having Ambient and MUI on linux means
Amiga/Morphos feeling without lacking most of the state of the art software.
Perhaps using zune instead of Mui would be the way to go.


[ Edited by eliot 16.12.2017 - 08:44 ]

Hi Eliot!

Thank you.

Well, I think we should stay with MUI delivered in MorphOS to keep things simple, consistent and not to depend on too many software providers. It would complicate the process a lot. Also I consider AROS as a research system, always in development, not designed for usual end-user. I think Ambient is already open source but MUI could be still a proprietary and maybe author woludn't like to contribute in this project, then Zune could be a way to go.

K

[ Edited by Kokos 16.12.2017 - 10:18 ]

Hmm...but still Linux underneath?

No thanks.

I'll wait for MorphOS X64, that should be able to run in a VM.
Then I can just run it concurrently with Windows.

Since I need Excel (which isn't available under Linux, and the Open Office spreadsheet can't provide full compatibility for) I need Windows, not Linux.

This would not be a port. It would end as a rewrite, because of the so called depedencies.

When porting FROM linux, ports often fail due missing linker/shared libs like GTK. While Amiga/MorphOS has tons of linux stuff like Freetype. exemul, png, jpeg and millions of other components to work with, ports are impossible due the lack of only a hand full others.

Well, when porting Ambient and MUI TO linux you have mostly none dependencies to work with. Beside maybe jpeg and png stuff, but even there the more recent ports use less linux stuff and more MorphOS native components.

Since Ambient is almost using every component available in MorphOS you "simply" have to port all these MorphOS components to Linux first.

Hence why there is no Ambient port for AmigaOS4! It is because even AmigaOS lacks of many features Ambient utilises. And those Systems are quite close.

So better keep you money and forget it. Not worth trying.

[ Edited by geit 16.12.2017 - 17:54 ]

> Perhaps using zune instead of Mui would be the way to go.

Some work was already done 20 years ago:

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=11382&start=81

I imagine it'd be comparatively "easier" to port the whole of MorphOS to the Linux kernel instead of Quark than rewrite the whole of MUI and Ambient.

Quote:

Isn't Excel a web app these days?

Quote:

Yes, I agree.

And, the proposed bounty sounds to me like a project that would require more than one programmer, working only during their free time, maybe 20 to 30 hours a week maximum. The proposed bounty project seems to be something almost as much work as the port to x64 for the whole MorphOS Dev. Team, but me not being an active advanced programmer, I can't accurately estimate how much actual work is involved in the proposal.

It also sounds like it might be something that Linux programmers could/would do themselves, if they thought that Ambient and MUI offered features significantly better than existing alternatives.

> Since I need Excel [...] I need Windows, not Linux.

https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=11

Sounds like something to this was done for BeOS/Zeta a few years back. Someone skinned BeOS onto Ubuntu. http://www.zevenos.com/

Personally me being a BeOS user it made using Linux much nicer and made me use Linux more. Was it perfect? No but this was done very well. I used this for many years up until issues I had with updating packages which most likely had nothing to so with the skinning. I'm sure some users will like having the Ambient/MUI skin on Linux and use Linux more but it is not Morphos in the end.

> I'm sure some users will like having the Ambient/MUI skin on Linux

As far as I have understood, the proposed bounty is about an actual Ambient/MUI port to Linux, not about a replication as a mere UI skin.

Ah it's that time of the year again:

BRAINFART-SEASON

Actually it's 3 bounties:

- OpenSource MUI or reimplement it for Linux

- Get Ambient to compile&run on top of that

- Adapt GTK/QT to interpret and use MUI skins

4 if we count the mandated 3 years support period

Each would need an at least 5 figure sum to be properly funded......

A skin of a skinable system would be kind of quadratic circle or so..
And I personally don't like an OS mimicking (copycat skin) another.

A port of MUI Ambient to Linux would be ambitious though. But probably not that rewarding. Under the skin it would stay Linux.

Taking the Linux kernel only for a MorphOS x64 would be another story, but honestly not the story I would like to tell (and using a Linux kernel with Amiga on top is not a new idea anyway).

Hi guys,

Thanks. Now I know it's more complicated then I thought it is. I'm not a developer (I don't need to be) but for me it sounds logical to migrate to Linux to preserve as PPC hardware will die eventually and using Linux kernel beneath would solve issues with drivers, web browser etc. Of course I know it would mean to leave behind all hard work team spent on MorphOS as it is and many solutions, so it's a dilemma and this is probably not an approach developers would like take on. I'm not here to decide on this I was just asking. Anyway, still it was worth asking, so please keep for yourselves and your families all impolite comments, it was not needed here at all.

Thanks.
K

Quote:

The 32 bit version included in Office 2016?
That should work, still as a non-native program the performance might suffer, and its not going to be constantly updated like Office 365.

I tend to shy away from emulated environments, but since I already mentioned implementing a VM its a fair comparison.

In reality, I be more likely use my laptop to run Windows while running MorphOS on a separate machine.

And...if I followed this course, I'd still be stuck trying to adapt to Linux.

Again, no thanks.

Quote:

WINE Is Not an Emulator Jim, there's no performance loss at all, some things run faster too. 64bit programs work fine too.

But if you have paid for Office doesn't it work in a browser too now?

Is MUI open source?

I mean: the most recent version that's used in MorphOS.

Quote:

According to the current documentation, only the 32 bit version of Excel 2016 works under Wine.
And yes, I have a separate Office package (not web based) now, but it was downloaded.
I might be able to find the original install.

As to "Wine is not an emulator", translator, emulator...whatever, it still doesn't make Windows apps native to Linux.

In any case, it would still involve adapting to Linux, which is a bit more cumbersome and less intuitive operating system.

I'd still prefer to stick with Windows and MorphOS.

I've experimented with Linux frequently since the '90's, and its never been a completely satisfying experience.

> Is MUI open source? I mean: the most recent version that's used in MorphOS.

No MUI version whatsoever is open source.

http://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=12173&forum=3

However, there's Zune.

http://aros.sourceforge.net/de/introduction/status/zune.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zune_(widget_toolkit)

Quote:
indeed

Quote:
Your "invention" is called Linux hosted AROS

Quote:

https://www.aeros-os.org

Thanks Intuition, not quite I hoped for, but better than nothing. I will ask there.

[ Edited by Kokos 19.12.2017 - 07:54 ]

Quote:
What's the point of this bounty if MUI isn't open source then?

You'd have to gain access to the sources before doing anything. Good luck with that.

Good luck with implementing missing functionnalites/fixing Zune if you were to go that road.