think of it this way...

if there was nothing in place, how do you expect people to pay for this? You and I both know MorphOS will be pirated if they didnt have anything in place at all. I think the model they have in place works for the little community that is left. If they (MorphOS Devel) decides that a certain users motherboard took a shi* and needs replacing, the situations like that need to be handled on a case-by-case basis.

How many people are going to upgrade from an EFIKA? Really. I mean people complain about buying a $99 motherboard, do you think that they'll upgrade to a more expensive mobo?

I'm holding out for MorphOS on the Mac Mini or something more powerful than the EFIKA I used to have. (nothing old like a Peg I, II).

Current situation is very bad. I paid 222.22 EUR for two MorphOS 2 licences and transfer both MorphOS licences to the new machines (EFIKA 2, EFIKA 8610) is not possible another 150 EUR/licence? It's bad for a single user which wants to help - translations MorphOS components to czech language, MorphOS testing & sending logs, writing articles about MorphOS (Pegasos/EFIKA) installation and configuration, maintaining MorphOS software database and Czech PUG site for MorphOS users, even some small Ambient changes in the past - everything for free, it costs me another extra money, I know - I'm not forced to do it... I continue to support MorphOS because of I like it, but all the support I put in MorphOS even when it's commercial now is not so fun like before if it costs me hundreds of EUROs and it will cost me more in future (150 per licence). Something must be changed. MorphOS 2+ can't costs so much for most devoted users. A lot of things I'm doing for MorphOS OS and MorphOS community, not only for myself. I tried to find a solution, one time key reactivations (time limited keys) + passwords etc. but in IT world all can be bypassed (atleast by computer clock change) and it seems that everything would be weakness in the end. "Funny" thing is that I paid Poseidon USB drivers key before MorphOS 2.0 release too. Maybe all the thing around MorphOS keys could be transformed to a "general support" in donation system - a lot of donations - f.e. new gfx drivers, new printer drivers, MorphOS SDK, Apple Mac Mini support and general support. I don't want to force you (MorphOS devs) to do what you don't want to do, these donations can be opened only if you agree with it. I would rather donate more money this way instead of forcing me to pay licences all around in the future. If you want you can set up limits which are required to start/complete some thing. Or it's not about the money? It's about that you can't promise users that something will be done? But we should know what you can do, what you can't, what you are working on - we put money and trust in you. There are no plans no roadmap at least and it's very frustating. I thing that people which don't even own Pegasos/EFIKA would support you for new features, new hardware support (Apple MacMini, ...), if MorphOS community will show them that MorphOS is great operating system which deserve it. I don't know what is best solution, maybe the best solution is hardware keys and it's very hard to try something else. I hope that "new" MorphOS hardware (f.e. Apple Mac Mini) will come soon, because community is too small now, more software developers and OS supporters are needed. I think that there are a lot of Apple machines waiting for MorphOS. I pray for MorphOS future ... maybe this is record in using word "MorphOS" per normal message


[ Edited by luky-amiga on 2008/11/4 9:30 ]

Code:

We are actually handling such cases already. If you want to be sure to get a new key, you can always ask your reseller to confirm that the hw is dead.

I think the "Smash & Take Picture" method is much more straightforward.

I bought one licence for my Peg2 but not for my Peg1 because :
- i use my Peg1 few hours / monthly (only when i go to see my parents)
- i'm not really happy to pay 2 licences full price for my personnal use.

There are many solutions :
- one licence per user
- one license per user and hadware type (Peg1 / Peg2 / Efika / ...)
- reduced price licence for more than 1 licence (will be the best idea imho)

Exemple :
You bought a licence for the peg1
the peg1 is dead
you "upgrade" your licence for a efika for a reduced price (30-40 euros is not bad)
Problem : how to disabled old key ?
Solution : there is name of licence owner is "about" so it's easy to see when a lincence is pirated.


[ Edited by Get27 on 2008/11/4 14:48 ]

Quote:

AH AH AH AH AH AH!!!!
You're better than Terminator!!!
And you created a new E.E.T. (Enemy Engage Tactic): after "Seek & Destroy", "Smash & Take Picture"!!!!

funny you mention terminator... yesterday I watched 6 episodes of "Terminator The Sarah Connor Chronicles" in a row. I guess that and playing GTAIV for a few hours on my PS3 is giving me ...ehrrr... inspiration ?

luky:

no offense, but how much of your "work" has turned into $$ for MorphOS devel? Why dont you charge for your work/reviews/translations and it will pay for a MorphOS license?

If I want something bad enough I will save the $ for it.

Maybe its just me, but I'd leave the current model in place but lowering the price is something that would help. 150 US$ seems reasonable.

Morphos is a little on the expensive side with it's 150 Euro. Altough the dollar has gained some strenght against the Euro in the last few weeks, it's still not a very competetive price in dollars.

On the other hand, lowering the price now, wouldn't be very fair against users that already bought a license... but I guess maybe 20% reduction for existing license holders when they buy another license in the future could solve this? Or maybe some x-mas action, reduce the price for a few weeks ?

Quote:

But it IS offensive, if you put yourself in Lukas' sittuation...

If license transfer would be allowed. I for one would buy a license for my Efika. It just doesn't make any sense to bind the license now to a system that I know I'm going to replace. Plus the system wont sell for much once MOS for Mac mini is released and it will also bring down the price on the license as it is not transferable.

I also think it's too much to ask full price for each of your own computers.

But how about compromise like possibility to register 2nd copy for half the price? But then if you'd need 3rd copy it would be full price again.. that would limit the possible abuse of getting cheap licenses to other people, but would help lot of people who have more than one system. At least it wouldn't be that bad for me to buy 2nd license for half the price when I'm going to upgrade to Mac mini for example. It wouldn't hurt that much if my current system would be left for little use after that...

exactly the same feeling I have about my Efika and getting a licensed copy for it.

Don't you think the MOS developers deserve to be paid for the additional work they have done to port MOS to the EFIKA?

If you have a license for MOS on the Peg1 or Peg2, I could see the team offering a discount for MOS on the EFIKA, but they are hardly making any money from their work on MOS as the user base is so tiny. Not many people will work for long hours on something only to give it away. They will likely want another license fee when/if they release the port of MOS for the Mac Mini, or Peg3, or EFIKA2.

I agree that it would be reasonable for them to offer a discount to loyal MOS users that have licenses already for prior computers, but not a free copy for different new computers.

Developers have to eat and pay utilities, rent/mortgage too. If there were more of us MOS users to buy the OS and hardware we could expect to pay less, so show your MOS computers to friends and family and help develop new programs for it to expand its usability.

I would love to only use MOS and never have to use Windows (or even MacOS and Linux) again. I would much rather have only one computer + one laptop + my Amiga Video Editing Studio computers (I know they are not relevant anymore with HDTV here, but they are still FUN! I would love to see a next gen NewTek Video Editing solution for MOS).

Quote:


Like he said, nobody asked him to do what he's doing. He did that on his own accord. If you cant afford to do what you're doing, dont do it?

> Don't you think the MOS developers deserve to be
> paid for the additional work they have done to
> port MOS to the EFIKA?

I was under the impression that Genesi already did so :-)

> They will likely want another license fee when/if
> they release the port of MOS for the Mac Mini, or
> Peg3, or EFIKA2.

They also want another full licence fee for a 2nd, 3rd, 4th and so on machine of the same kind (Pegasos 2 for instance). So it has little to do with the costs of porting to another platform rather than the costs of MorphOS development in general. Not that I have any problems with that. I hope to find someone to buy my Pegasos I plus bound MorphOS licence for the original licence costs alone once MorphOS for Mac Mini is released though :-)

And btw, "Pegasos" (as in the name) was long declared dead by Genesi, so there will never ever be a "Pegasos" again. A Pegasos successor (if ever happening) will likely be called "Efika [something]".

@luky-amiga

I really hope MOS-Team considers using USB-dongles in the future.

Quote:

Quote:

I guess they won't: It would require sending physical goods to customers, instead of just sending software through internet, which is much easier and cheaper for them (and everyone else).

The problem is invalidating existing licenses: There's no way to tell if a given license is still in use. That's why MorphOS Team can't exchange the old one in a (said to be) broken computer for a new one.

In the other hand, it would be very nice if MorphOS team treated better its customers, and offered additional licenses at a much lower price.
But then, somebody could ask for ten additional licenses, reduced price, and then sell them as first ones, full price, to nine ignorant people.
Does anyone here think this is remotely possible?

In the meantime, the current model keeps on hurting MorphOS' popularity. In fact, it kill popularity flat out.

The current licensing model is outrageous for a hobby operating system. Everyone else I've talked about thinks we are nuts for accepting it.

accepting ? I am not accepting this, I wait for a more powerfull machine or a transferable license. It doesn't have to be for free ... but another 150 Euro ?

i guess we need somebody like obama in the mos team, who actually really pays attention to the community :)

i mean, i've never bought OS3.9 twice when my amiga1200 or A4000 died. the comparison is nonsense all the way. the main difference is, that i can install the one and only OS3.9 CD i have, to every computer i like, there is no kind of hardware dongeling. its just sad that you dont have any trust in the community. nobody has every done something like that, not microsoft and not apple. looks like your perfection has gone into the wrong way.

i mean, when i buy a license it means that i can use that OS on one machine at once. do you honestly think that mac mini users are going to buy morphos when they hear about this crap of hardware dongeling? You're on the best way of killing the system yourself. But then, please dont blame the users or anybody else.
you could at least lower the price, but this is nothing else than a risky game. Game Over when the machine's dead.

another possibility could be to make seperate keys for Peg2, Peg1, Efika and Mac Mini. so lets say if someone has a peg2 he could use that key just on all the peg2s. if he buys another efika or mini he would have to buy a new key for those machines. at least this way, it wouldn't be possible to say, damn my peg2 just broke and now i want to use my old key on the peg3 or mini or whatever better machine's out there.

All excellent points, AmigaDave,Cego,takemehomegrandma,
Oepabakkes, everyone
For the price I payed to support(which I don't mind) buying the efika, peripherals, key ect, i could have gotten a laptop(again)and put aros on it, and do the same things. The efika users suffer because at some point there is no choice but to upgrade because it's just not that strong a system to do the things one may want to do. right now i'm limited to downloading.....that's it oh and mplayer(sup fab?!)
but we will have to should we choose, get the next board released , along with the next ver of morphos if one's released. $600Us for efika 1 with a dvdrw which i cant use on this model because of issues, a $40 printer cant use, usb seagate 250gig trial and error but it works, ethernet bridge for wireless capabilities and mouse/key combo, which drops freezes depending on what you're doing,,,and pair of usb joypads (one which nolonger works since theupgrade) for vgp2. who wants an efika knowing that better systems may be on the way?
Cut us a break here! Avid supporters will be there, hopefully this is not like pirating software games of the past! if i knew better(options) systems were coming, then i might have waited, but then again we were starving for anything from amigaland!


[ Edited by xyphoid on 2008/11/6 14:06 ]

<my 0.02€>
I still think a price >100 EUR isn't really helpful in terms of the sales number (pricing is a lot about psychology, a lean 100 is much, much easier spent than 150, it 'sounds and feels' much lesser). But that is only my assessment (but I worked for quite a while in the market research business) as someone who's not in charge to decide.
I strongly recommend to lower the price to 99 EUR (yeah, that'sl the magic number) once the Mac Mini version comes out. I am sure the total turnover will get higher with a two digit pricetag. That way you will get a few new customers and extent the MorphOS user base a bit beyond this current little exclusive club of "lost souls".
Binding it to a particular harware item is okay IMO (well ideally it would be not bound, but the world is just not ideal).
</my 0.02€>

Quote:

$600?????

I only paid $176 for my EFIKA with case & PSU and another $39 for my 9250 128mb graphics card. The license fee for MOS was about $200 I think, so my total comes to a little over $400. Add in the $60 for my DVDRW and still I am well under $500.

It was an acceptable price for me to start with MOS as I have been wanting to see what it was and how well it could run older Amiga programs, as well as seeing what new software has been written for MOS.

I wanted to commit to one of the next gen Amiga OSes and begin to code something for them, instead of sitting on the sidelines any longer. Had I known that the SAM440ep and AOS4.1 would be released so shortly after my purchase, I might have waited and possibly tempted to go in that direction instead, but with the entry price of a complete SAM system reaching close to $1,000 - $1,300 or more with the AOS license fee, I probably still would have ended up with my EFIKA.

I am hoping that someone will figure out a DIY way to add an additional 128mb RAM to the bottom of the EFIKA mobo and how to add a two PCI slot riser card which will allow the use of my 9250 graphics card and a USB2.0 PCI card that will allow EFIKA users to burn CD's and DVD's. Then if the MOS team can fix the EFIKA's USB lock up problem, I will be satisfied with the operation of my EFIKA as a complete and usable low power computer with a light and fast operating system which only needs more software and continuing enhancements to browsers for it.

> Problem : how to disabled old key ?
> Solution : there is name of licence owner is "about"
> so it's easy to see when a lincence is pirated.

Well thought out ...not.