Will the release (eventually) of MorphOS3.0 for the G4 PPC Mac Mini make a difference in the number of users and developers that will join our tiny community?

I think yes, but I could be wrong. What do you think? Will the increased performance of the 1.5GHz G4 CPU and reported superior memory access speed of the Mac Mini compared to the Pegasos2 lure more AmigaOS4.x users over to MorphOS3.0, or will the performance difference not be great enough to make any difference?

[ Edited by amigadave on 2009/6/16 2:21 ]

While indeed we can count on more or less 2x performance compared to Pegasos 2, the performance is not the most important factor here. Very few existing MorphOS applications really need more CPU power. The best thing is hardware availability and encouraging price/power factor. Current MorphOS hardware options are very limited. One has a choice between discontinued, expensive, hard to obtain Pegasos 2 and low-end Efika, which is not really a desktop design. MacMini changes the whole picture, being fast, modern (compared to Peg 2), available and relatively cheap hardware.

I guess releasing MorphOS for MacMini can increase current user community, the growth will be not thrilling but noticeable. Yes, it can also convince some people to choose MorphOS instead of AmigaOS 4, but the number of changing the train will be low. Significant part of current AmigaOS 4 userbase is convinced to it by ideology rather than system features or hardware availability. MorphOS technical advancement and possibility to run MorphOS on Mini won't change their mind, especially as they will start to believe OS4 will be released for Mini too.

[ Edited by Krashan on 2009/6/16 10:38 ]

@amigadave
I don't think it will "lure" any AmigaOS4.x users over to MorphOS. But it will attract more users. Right now, any MorphOS (or OS4.x) fan can describe to their friends why it is nice to use their favourite OS, but they can't point them to an easily available, reasonably priced piece of HW to try it out for themselves. When MOS comes out for the Mini, you can say "...and you can pick up a PPC Mac Mini on eBay, if you want to try it yourself".

@Krashan
Ideology is not the only reason people would stick to OS4. I bought a Pegasos, built up a tower and all the bits to try out MorphOS. It was really nice. But when I needed some cash and decided to sell one of my computers, I sold the Peg and kept the A1 because I just preferred using OS4. Lucky it was Peg I, because now I would be kicking myself. I'd love to be able to dual boot OS4 and MOS, but I think if I had a Peg II, it would spend most of its time running OS4.

because I just preferred using OS4

You are just a proof of my thesis. Just maybe the word "ideology" is too strong and may be mistaken with fanboyism. What I wanted to say is that many OS4 users prefer their system "just because they prefer it". Then no technical or economical arguments can grab their attention toward MorphOS. Of course it works both ways, many MorphOS users won't be interested in AmigaOS 4 on whatever hardware it will run in the future.

I've manged to get my hands on one not, but 2 PPC Power Macs, (they were cheap, I had too! The devil made me etc etc), and I've been trying out various Linuxes on them, and they're hard/buggy to install, and when you do install them, they simply are not as resource friendly as Tiger even on the Dual 533 G4. Now there may be an older one or something I've not used that make work like a dream, but Linux on PPC macs? Nothing like an lightweight alternative to MacOSX, Something that I feel having finally got a version of MorphOS running at home after so long, would be perfect for lightweight replacement for MacOSX.

Sure it's a little err.. unstable, cuz of no memory protection, but it is for me at least*, FUN!

*Well I would say that wouldn't I? This being a Morphzone, not LinuxZone etc etc.

[ Edited by stephen_robinson on 2009/6/16 18:03 ]

> the release (eventually) of MorphOS3.0 for the G4 PPC Mac Mini

MorphOS Team members said like months ago that Mac mini support will most likely come with MorphOS 2.4 (and not with 2.3 or 3.0 as speculated by many).

> Ideology is not the only reason people would stick to OS4. [...] I
> [...] kept the A1 because I just preferred using OS4. [...] I think
> if I had a Peg II, it would spend most of its time running OS4.

And where's that a reason other than ideology (not that it would be a bad thing)? Or did I just miss your listing of real reasons as to why you prefer OS4 over MorphOS?

@krash

maybe same reason Windows prevailed over technically superior systems?...the best "technical" system doesn't always translate into the most popular or biggest for market share. Many other factors determine the success.

@Andreas_Wolf

I have my reasons, but not ideology. To me, preferring OS4 because of "Idealogy" means things like "because its the real amiga!", not because you enjoy using it more. The former doesn't apply to me, the latter does.

@amigadave

What kind of question is that???

Hence, I'll reply with a quote from my wife who keeps repeating it all over:

Yes, Yes, Yes!

Say, any IT people here?

> To me, preferring OS4 because of "Idealogy" means things like
> "because its the real amiga!", not because you enjoy using it more.
> The former doesn't apply to me, the latter does.

Fair enough. That's a pretty good reason indeed :-)

I think it will.. not initially but I'd expect more users in the MorphOS community. If only there was a release date...

It might lure a few more users, maybe even me. The sad thing is that the people selling Macminis on ebay or similar places somehow think the Macmini is worth several hundred dollars/euros(almost the same as they were new), which a half decade lowspecced discontinued product surely isn't.

That said, if MorphOS for Macmini is ever released and I find a Macmini for around hundred euros, I will make a comeback.

I guess that the most people in here that already use MorpHOS on Peg / Efika would get a Mini. It is cheap, easy to be found and small.

I guess that Amiga users that keep an eye to the MorphOS scene having not a Peg / Efika would probably buy one, if they want to try MorphOS. Thoe will be the new ones.

I am finding it hard for someone (Mac user??) not even knowing what MorphOS is and having not involved with Amiga scene in the past or present, to grab a Mni just because MorphOS is ported there.

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It is simply a matter of taste which OS someone would choose. At the moment Peg2 is the ultimate machine, it can runs both OSes. someone can stick on his own preferred hardware / OS for his own reasons, but in fact nothing can beat Peg2. Even OS4 is running faster and smoother on Peg than on Samantha -I got both machines so I can compare-, but still MorphOS is even more faster and more complete for me.

I can respect all those ideological points about "real Amiga" but can someone explain what real Amiga is or should be? I guess not. To my eyes MorphOS is more a "real Amiga" operating system and NOTHING else -talking about OSes- was able to give me back the fun and the enjoyment I had the firts days of my Peg1 with 1.4.5 -and sitll goes with 2.2- but again this is just me.

@TheMagicM

I think the plan is to have a release date.

I don't think, an other PPC-plattform will give a boost to MorphOS.
Although MorphOS is somewhat better than OS4.1, OS4.1 isn't MAC-locked, which really pissed me on the 2.x version.

Both OS suffer the obsolete thinking of "closed software". Some overloaded core developers do all the work, with no chance for users to interact.
This concept is also the reason, why MorphOS isn't yet available for many PPC-plattforms.
( Have a look at linux to see the progress of different licensing.)

I'll keep my 3 PEG's for nostalgic reasons, but there's strong doubt about the future of both OS, no matter what obsolete hardware they could be installed.

Judas,

Even if they are not opensource, it doesn't prevent anyone from developping anything (except video drivers or very lowlevel kernel stuff). The external developers just don't need an opensourced OS to do something, that's just a bad excuse.

And by the way, the holy opensourced linux uses an even more outdated concept of monolithic kernel where touching a supposedly external module often means getting the kernel source and recompiling along with the module. Not very fun if you ask me.

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3 pegs for someone who's so sceptical and demotivated may be a bit too much ? no offense but what about selling at least 2 of them to some enthusiastic morphos users ?

the holy opensourced linux uses an even more outdated concept of monolithic kernel

The holy opensourced Linux has also at least 4 partially incompatible (in spite of being opensourced...) audio API-s. Baroque architecture of its current video drivers kills performance and is an example of softare design disaster...

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You mean to say that you are a Moderator here, but you are not a MorphOS user anymore? That is a strange devotion to this group, or the OS itself.

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I thought so too, but I was asked to stay nevertheless, by Targhan.

@Golem:

yea I'm sure.. I'm just excited about finally using my Mini(s).. lol

@CountRaven:

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Its not those users you're counting o switching. Alot of those users are just content with what their OS does, they dont venture ouf into the open. Then you have the power users which would be willing to try dual booting etc. Those are the users you would be targeting. IMO

Quote:

I am afraid you are correct, but all the power users would either not have purchased the low spec MacMini in the first place, or if they had, they would have replaced it long ago and gotten rid of it to someone who does not fit the type that would be interested in running a dual boot MorphOS/MacOS config., or a single boot MorphOS install.

So, most of the Mac users that might be interested in trying out MorphOS will likely need to purchase, or re-purchase a G4 PPC MacMini to do so and only a few will still have one stashed away in their closet that they can pull out and test with. I hope that there are not too many G4 PPC MacMini's that have just been recycled, or trashed, but I am sure there are still ten times the number needed, if not hundreds of times the number needed to satisfy the demand.

A lot of folks keep saying that this won't lure MAC users to Morph OS... That is true, but the MAC users aren't the target audience for Morph OS in the first place.. The Mac Mini is simply an affordable avenue to trying Morph OS and yet still providing an "escape route" for the less adventurous but yet still inquisitive computer hobbyist...

As a newbie to the Morph OS world, I can tell you that I watched Morph OS for quite some time before I decided to take the Efika plunge... I don't regret doing it because I enjoy these kinds of endeavors, but to be perfectly honest, the Efika in it's first incarnation was wholly overpriced. I just about guarantee that the costs to play with this hobbyist toy certainly scares people away. Amiga OS4 has the same issue...

The Mac Mini, however; is MUCH more powerful than any of the previous platforms, is fairly affordable and if you don't fall in love with Morphos you can always run Tiger on it.. And THAT escape route is a very comforting thought when debating whether to take the Morph plunge...

This way there is nothing to lose!

So, yes I think it will eventually make a dramatic difference for the better...