MorphOS on AmigaOne X5000?
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >>> special Debian 8 Jessie PowerPC SPE demonstration

    >> On the P-Cubed? SCNR ;-)

    > Or perhaps on the rumored mini-ITX PPC board from A-Eon?

    Zigotzky wrote on the Freescale forum that he bought his P1022-based board in 2014. I don't think this fits a potential new board from A-Eon.
  • »05.10.15 - 22:56
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1110 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    I can understand A-Eon not promoting MorphOS on the X5000 until the
    port is actually completed .


    OS4 isn't even complete for the five year old X1000, what makes you think it's in a more complete state for the X5000 than MorphOS for the X5000?
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.15

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  • »05.10.15 - 22:57
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> Or perhaps on the rumored mini-ITX PPC board from A-Eon?

    > Would be really interesting if it would turn out to be based on e500v2!

    I'm sure you would applaud that :-) A new lower-end board from A-Eon would most likely be e5500-based (QorIQ T1) I guess.
  • »05.10.15 - 23:00
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Spectre660
    Posts: 275 from 2015/6/30
    I would assume that A-Eon has an agreement with Hyperion re AmigaOS 4.x for the current A-Eon hardware so AmigaOS 4.x is going to be OS featured and shipped with the machines .

    If the agreement does not cover all future motherboards then
    I see no reason why Morphos can't make a deal with A-Eon for future Motherboards to have MorphOS as the featured and bundled OS .

    The promotion of alternate OS options in either case should not be a problem once the alternate OS options were available .

    (Posting this on my new secret A-eon hardware by the way)

    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    Quote:

    I can understand A-Eon not promoting MorphOS on the X5000 until the
    port is actually completed .


    OS4 isn't even complete for the five year old X1000, what makes you think it's in a more complete state for the X5000 than MorphOS for the X5000?




    [ Edited by Spectre660 05.10.2015 - 18:35 ]
  • »05.10.15 - 23:33
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Zylesea
    Posts: 2053 from 2003/6/4
    Quote:

    Doffo schrieb:
    Hope MorphOS drops support for the X5000. :)


    Me too. in _my_ opinion every additional day spend with ppc is a rather lost day. Of course I am also curious about how MorphOS will work on the X5000 and I am even a bit interested in buying one, but I would much much more love to buy a nice i7 system to run MorphOS on it.
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  • »06.10.15 - 00:52
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1424 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Zylesea wrote:
    Me too. in _my_ opinion every additional day spend with ppc is a rather lost day. Of course I am also curious about how MorphOS will work on the X5000 and I am even a bit interested in buying one, but I would much much more love to buy a nice i7 system to run MorphOS on it.


    Me 3. It is almost battered wife syndrome. Why support product from a company that won't even acknowledge your existence?

    I also agree we need to move on from the kiddie pool that is PPC. Supporting PPC Mac was the right step for the time. This left turn to Bizaro world is puzzling. Why support such crazy overpriced hardware when the people behind them want you to die off? The best scenario doesn't have the X5000 faster than a G5 Mac at last check.

    [ Edited by redrumloa 05.10.2015 - 19:06 ]
  • »06.10.15 - 01:05
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > The best scenario doesn't have the X5000 faster than a G5 Mac at last check.

    I'm interested in the figures of your check. Can you publish them?
  • »06.10.15 - 01:30
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Everblue
    Posts: 167 from 2004/1/6
    Imagine the scenario where x64 version of MorphOS is available when the X5000 is about to be released. So people would have two options.... drop 2500 Euro for brand new hardware which runs Amiga OS, or spend a few hundred to get a probably faster x64 system and using MorphOS. I know what most would choose.
  • »06.10.15 - 08:30
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Imagine the scenario where x64 version of MorphOS is available when the X5000 is
    > about to be released.

    Why imagine a completely unrealistic scenario?

    > drop 2500 Euro for brand new hardware which runs Amiga OS

    ...and MorphOS and Linux.
  • »06.10.15 - 09:05
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1724 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    I guess supporting the X5000 is a step torwards a system jump. Except the PPC, the X5000 use perfectly modern hardware AFAIK. So once they got those stuff working there it will be a lot less work to port to another CPU.
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  • »06.10.15 - 10:38
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Jim
    Posts: 4977 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > For fun you could google PowerpcSPE

    For even more fun you could click the following links and realize that I surely don't need any lessons regarding this :-)

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=6565&start=10
    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=8473&start=49

    > and see what processors are supported.

    I already know this. Guess which CPU the P-Cubed was supposed to use most likely.

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=7183&start=840

    ...which is the same CPU as on Zigotzky's "P1022 Custom board".

    https://community.freescale.com/thread/339022
    https://community.freescale.com/thread/342970
    https://community.freescale.com/thread/357813


    Hyuk! Somebody has been trying to educate YOU Andreas?
    I miss so much when I take off for awhile.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »06.10.15 - 11:06
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > the X5000 use perfectly modern hardware AFAIK.

    DDR3, PCIe v2, SATA2 and USB2 are all at least one generation behind.

    > once they got those stuff working there it will be a lot less work to port
    > to another CPU.

    I don't see how this will benefit an ISA switch, the hard part of which has nothing to do with support for above-mentioned subsystems.
  • »06.10.15 - 11:21
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Everblue
    Posts: 167 from 2004/1/6
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > Imagine the scenario where x64 version of MorphOS is available when the X5000 is
    > about to be released.

    Why imagine a completely unrealistic scenario?

    > drop 2500 Euro for brand new hardware which runs Amiga OS

    ...and MorphOS and Linux.


    Because imagination is free :) - and day dreaming gives good vibes
  • »06.10.15 - 11:46
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1724 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    @Andreas_Wolf

    Newer gfx cards at least. But if the components are at the same generation as the latest ported PPC Macs you are right.

    [ Edited by Yasu 06.10.2015 - 12:37 ]
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  • »06.10.15 - 12:37
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Newer gfx cards at least.

    Sam460 port would suffice for this, no X5000 port needed :-)

    > if the components are at the same generation as the latest ported PPC Macs you are right.

    Why compare with those when the Sam460 has the newer components? PowerMac7,3 has DDR1, no PCIe and SATA1 whereas the Sam460 has DDR2, PCIe v1 and SATA2. So in this regard, the Sam460 is closer to the X5000 than the PowerMac7,3.

    In summary:

    DDR1, no PCIe, SATA1, USB2 -> PowerMac7,3
    DDR2, PCIe v1, SATA2, USB2 -> Sam460
    DDR3, PCIe v2, SATA2, USB2 -> AmigaOne X5000
    DDR4, PCIe v3, SATA3, USB3 -> current standards

    With that said, I still doubt that the support of DDR3 (vs. DDR2) and PCIe v2 (vs. PCIe v1) will really help the ISA switch.
  • »06.10.15 - 13:41
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1724 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    @Andreas_Wolf

    You are right again. I should have looked at the specs instead of posting assumptions.
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
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  • »06.10.15 - 14:48
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    takemehomegrandma
    Posts: 2720 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:

    I still doubt that the support of DDR3 (vs. DDR2) and PCIe v2 (vs. PCIe v1) will really help the ISA switch.


    Indeed, you write drivers for specific controllers, not generic "generations". Then we of course have underlying technology changes that might need to be addressed as well (like USB3 in Poseidon for example)...
    MorphOS is Amiga done right! :-)
    MorphOS NG will be AROS done right! :-)
  • »06.10.15 - 15:11
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > you write drivers for specific controllers, not generic "generations".

    This runs contrary to the idea of UHCI/OHCI/EHCI/XHCI in case of USB and AHCI in case of SATA.

    > Then we of course have underlying technology changes that might
    > need to be addressed as well

    ...and usually come with "generation" shift.
  • »06.10.15 - 16:26
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  • Moderator
    Kronos
    Posts: 2236 from 2003/2/24
    All nice, but PCIe and DDR2/3 RAM are things that matter on a HW level, and to some extent for the firmware.

    A driver would be written for say the R700 series and it would than look wether Quark had found such a device somewhere.

    Wether it's connected to PCIe or otherwise is off little concern to the driver.
  • »06.10.15 - 20:48
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12071 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > PCIe and DDR2/3 RAM are things that matter on a HW level, and to some extent for the firmware.

    Even more reason that X5000 support cannot be seen as step towards an ISA switch.

    > Wether it's connected to PCIe or otherwise is off little concern to the driver.

    But there has to be code in the OS for the actual PCIe controller, right?

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=11249&forum=11&start=9
  • »06.10.15 - 21:22
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    amigadave
    Posts: 2794 from 2006/3/21
    From: Northern Calif...
    Quote:

    redrumloa wrote:
    ........Why support such crazy overpriced hardware when the people behind them want you to die off? The best scenario doesn't have the X5000 faster than a G5 Mac at last check.


    What rock have you been hiding under? A-Eon and the people behind that company have never wished MorphOS and its users and developers any ill will. The founding member of A-Eon, Trevor Dickenson, even has several MorphOS systems and has written about his use of them, including complimenting MorphOS and its developers, on his blog, or spoke about them in person at different events.
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »06.10.15 - 23:43
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1424 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    amigadave wrote:
    What rock have you been hiding under? A-Eon and the people behind that company have never wished MorphOS and its users and developers any ill will. The founding member of A-Eon, Trevor Dickenson, even has several MorphOS systems and has written about his use of them, including complimenting MorphOS and its developers, on his blog, or spoke about them in person at different events.


    More like, what rock have you been under?

    No mention of MorphOS:
    https://m.facebook.com/AEonTechnologyLtd/photos/a.461608890516168.110788.447768335233557/1082048695138848/?type=3&source=48

    No mention of MorphOS, but rather a Debian mention:
    https://m.facebook.com/AEonTechnologyLtd/photos/a.461608890516168.110788.447768335233557/1083129291697455/?type=3&refid=17

    It looks as though A-Eonkit may be backtracking on their promises:
    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=11137&post_id=121499&viewmode=flat&sortorder=0&showonepost=1

    Day to day operations of A-Eonkit are not run by Trevor. He may actually personally like MorphOS and be friendly, but his company does not operate in such a manner.

    [ Edited by redrumloa 07.10.2015 - 06:55 ]
  • »07.10.15 - 12:54
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Jim
    Posts: 4977 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Yasu wrote:
    @Andreas_Wolf

    Newer gfx cards at least. But if the components are at the same generation as the latest ported PPC Macs you are right.


    Nope, except for USB, the Macs are one generation behind.
    And we don't have support for PCI-e G5s, which will only take up to an R500 video card anyway unless the drivers are written like the R500 driver and don't require an Apple rom.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »07.10.15 - 13:27
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
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    Jim
    Posts: 4977 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    @ Red and thread,

    Don't worry A-eon is doing its part.
    Once the machines are available to the public (which they aren't) our developers will have to formally announce a revision with X5000 support.
    Lets not get ahead of ourselves.
    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »07.10.15 - 13:32
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  • MorphOS Developer
    bigfoot
    Posts: 508 from 2003/4/11
    Just before this derails any further into lala-land...

    A-EON have been supportive and helpful in getting MorphOS supported on the X5000, both in terms of hardware and software. They lent us a P5020DS as well as shipped X5000 motherboards completely free of charge to both me and Frank, and they've offered their support where they could with regards to software as well.

    In fact we (the MorphOS Team) have only recently been able to offer A-EON a beta version of MorphOS to run on the X5000 very recently, so obviously A-EON haven't been able to publish their own screenshots of MorphOS running on the X5000, nor have they been able to write first hand about it.

    Quote:

    redrumloa wrote:

    It looks as though A-Eonkit may be backtracking on their promises:
    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=11&topic_id=11137&post_id=121499&viewmode=flat&sortorder=0&showonepost=1


    I'm guessing there's a language barrier here. What is meant is that A-EON have offered to sell pre-release systems to any MorphOS developers or testers who were interested. I know at least one person took them up on that offer and got the machine as well, so nothing bad at all to be said there.
    I rarely log in to MorphZone which means that I often miss private messages sent on here. If you wish to contact me, please email me at [username]@asgaard.morphos-team.net, where [username] is my username here on MorphZone.
  • »07.10.15 - 13:37
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