I was looking at Powerbook specs and it occurred to me that the 1.67Ghz 7447a was probably not a better performer then the processors we already have in the better Powermacs.
The 1.42Ghz 7455 in the top MDDs and my own 1.8 Ghz 7447 ought to be at least equal if not better then the 1.67 7447a.
And I've heard that the is at least one MorphOS user that has a 2.0 Ghz 7448 processor in his machine.

So, if our top performance choices have already plateaued, do we have a good way to comparatively benchmark these systems to highlight the advantages of each?

Edit - Ah, so what eh? I think I may buy a Powerbook anyway.

[ Edited by Jim 02.04.2011 - 18:43 ]

> my own 1.8 Ghz 7447 ought to be at least equal if not better then the 1.67 7447a.

Yes, of course it's faster. It's the same processor at higher clock speed after all. But that doesn't matter anyway as the purpose of PowerBook support for MorphOS is not so much about having better speed but more about having a mobile solution for MorphOS.

> do we have a good way to comparatively benchmark these systems to
> highlight the advantages of each?

As said, the no. 1 advantage of the PowerBook is that it's a mobile computer. No benchmark needed for this ;-)

>As said, the no. 1 advantage of the PowerBook is that it's a mobile computer. No benchmark needed for this ;-

Thanks again for pointing out something that should have been clear to me, Andreas.
Outside of laptops with AROS installed (which holds no appeal for me) this will be the first transportable system for our market.
That's one of the reasons I added that last line to the first post. I can see the utility in that and 1.67 still pretty fast.
I'm looking for one right now (a 17 inch since they seem to have more VRAM).

I think the developers must have been under the impression that i thought G5 support was immanent. I didn't, I just like to plan ahead. After all, my Powermac was ready about half a year before 2.6 was released (and I didn't expect support for Powermacs to arrive that early, I would have been fine waiting two or three times longer).

> a 17 inch since they seem to have more VRAM

One of the two 15" 1.67 GHz PowerBooks has 128 MiB VRAM as well:

http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powerbook_g4/stats/powerbook_g4_1.67_15_hr.html

Thanks. That is really useful to know. I didn't pick the 17 inch because I preferred it. Rather, I just wanted the extra video memory.
Frankly, I've always found really large notebooks cumbersome.
The 15 inch you've mentioned is well worth looking for.

Andreas, I'm beginning to get the weird impression that I could ask you for advice about almost any decision I was considering making and you could suggest a slight twist to improve the outcome.

One question on the two models.

The later 17 inch Powerbooks (and the 15 inch models for that matter) use DDR2 and appear to have a different chipset.

Do you think this will present a problem when MorphOS support is introduced?

> Do you think this will present a problem when MorphOS support is introduced?

Not according to what jacadcaps told numerous times, quite to the contrary.

That's reassuring considering I just placed a bid on one. Thanks again for pointing this out as the 15 inch models sell for less and are less popular (in the US).
BTW - The later 1.5 Ghz models also appear to have 128mb of VRAM.

> The later 1.5 Ghz models also appear to have 128mb of VRAM.

No, that would certainly be a misstatement.

http://support.apple.com/kb/SP48

>> The later 1.5 Ghz models also appear to have 128mb of VRAM.

>No, that would certainly be a misstatement.

http://support.apple.com/kb/SP48

That page only covers the PC2700 models which list the 1.67 model's.VRAM as 64MB unless you opt for a BTO option..


Do you have a reference for the DDR2 model?

> Do you have a reference for the DDR2 model?

Of course:

http://support.apple.com/kb/SP38

As you can see, there's even no PowerBook G4 at 1.5 GHz with DDR2 RAM, Radeon GPU and 15+" display, that's why I thought you meant the previous generation, which has at least a model at 1.5 GHz with Radeon GPU (64 MiB VRAM) and 15" display. So I still don't know which 1.5 GHz model with alleged 128 MiB VRAM you mean.

Wow, there are a couple of really off base Ebay postings in the US today.
Good thing I bid on a 1.67Ghz model. I hope the DDR2 listed in the screenshot isn't from another system.

The dual layer SuperDrive also sounds useful.
Again, thanks for mentioning this specific model. It looks ideal.

@Andreas

Actually, the rev-c 1.5GHz model came in a 128MB variant too, although it's very rare (see everymac.com)

> the rev-c 1.5GHz model came in a 128MB variant too, although
> it's very rare (see everymac.com)

You're right. Thanks for correcting me. Apparantly, for this 1.5 GHz 15" model the 128 MiB VRAM BTO option is not listed on apple.com while for the 1.67 GHz 15" model of the same generation it is.

For Jim and others who might want to know more:
http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powerbook_g4/stats/powerbook_g4_1.5_15_2.html

At least I was right that there's no such model in the last PowerBook G4 generation ;-)

i have rev-c with 128mb :)

> i have rev-c with 128mb :)

At 1.5 GHz (as that's what the confusion was about)?

Wow! What a round about way of getting confirmation that there are 128MB VRAM 1.5Ghz Powerbooks.
Can I assume the DDR2 model of the 1.67 still might offer some advantages over the earlier models?

I have seen a 2 Ghz 7447 Single CPU Powerlogix upgrade card on ebay a couple of months ago. These are rare. I wonder how they compare to the 7448 and the lower Mhz, bigger cache, faster memory 7455 in real world applications.

[ Edited by cdfr 04.04.2011 - 13:43 ]

> Can I assume the DDR2 model of the 1.67 still might offer some advantages
> over the earlier models?

Back answer: Why shouldn't it? ;-)

Memory benchmarks of the 7448 under MorphOS are surprisingly low. This may be due to that processor current support level under the OS.
At this point the difference between the 7447 and 7448 may not be that much.

> I have seen a 2 Ghz 7447 Single CPU Powerlogix upgrade card on ebay
> a couple of months ago. [...] I wonder how they compare to the 7448 and
> the lower Mhz, bigger cache, faster memory 7455 in real world applications.

For benchmark comparisons between 7455, 7447A and 7448 see posting #37 of this thread:

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=7638&start=36
(Unfortunately, the recent MorphZone software update broke direct linking to postings.)

Besides, the 7447A has double the L2 cache compared to the 7455 (but no L3 cache). And the memory speed is the same for both.

Some of these tests are MP aware (so not directly comparable to what we would get on MorphO). Ideally we would have some MorphOS comparisons for stuff like decoding / encoding video /complex web pages / games / emulation. Not easy to come up with a standard bench and also multiple memory / HD / video card combination makes this difficult.

> Some of these tests are MP aware (so not directly comparable to
> what we would get on MorphO).

*My* calculated results which I linked to are comparisons of the CPUs (only single vs. single and dual vs. dual, not mixed). That's why I didn't quote any benchmark points or times of the programs (we don't have those on MorphOS anyway) from the articles but only calculated the *relative* results of the CPUs (again: no mixed CPU count), which ideally shouldn't be much different from the *relative* results under MorphOS. At least that's what I thought you asked for: relative results.

> Ideally we would have some MorphOS comparisons for stuff like decoding / encoding
> video /complex web pages / games / emulation. Not easy to come up with a standard
> bench and also multiple memory / HD / video card combination makes this difficult.

Just define a set of applications and a set of data for each application (if required), open a thread here on MorphZone with your own results and there you go :-)

Quote:

This could be real if there will be Wifi support under MorphOS. This is not such an easy task, at least that was what I last heard from the team, ages ago. Hope for this to change. Wifi under MorphOs on PowerBook will be great. I am posting form my 1.67, 17'' PowerBook right now. Still under MacOSX, having high hopes for MorphOS :)

Obviously Powerbooks without Wifi are not that practical.
Its odd that I can add a wifi card to my Powermac, but the team was considering support of the Powerbooks without it.
I prefer my Powermac to be hook to my router via a cat5 cable, but having to do so with a Powerbook would be irritating.

BTW - Why don't I see a 'Quote' button in Reply anymore?