Not having the 'Inspect Element' option (program icon button/right-mouse context-menu), as I understand what you have already said on this feature, will that no longer allow certain features on a webpage, like removing some code, (e.g. footer) easily with Delete Node option be completely removed from what can be achieved with Wayfarer?

Some webpages have troublesome code that interferes with how the webpage should be displayed/respond, and sometimes I find I have to delete/change some parameters to get the page to function, either as intended, or to allow me to view certain parts of the webpage. So, if this feature is entirely removed then that will be, for me at least, a problem I am not sure how to get past very easily. Other than using an old release of OWB to do so, but as it gets older then this may not allow the necessary features to be edited as required.

So, if it is possible to put some rudimentary or more enhanced form of this feature into Wayfarer at some point, even if that is for a later release, then that would be a plus-point for me, and probably for other users.

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PDF is mostly "free" once you've implemented printing, so yeah.

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Maybe, certainly not a priority right now. There's a lot of various customizations you can do with the UI, but I don't see a point when basic functionality is missing. Many things will simply come after the initial release.

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Dunno. I have not investigated how these are handled in WebCore yet. Those icons actually end up costing quite a bit of performance in OWB (once you have a lot of them), so the answer for now will be "no, unless I figure out how to mitigate the performance penalty".

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Adding that would make rebasing to a more recent WebCore harder, so well...

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Working on resume since that part is, sadly, unfinished in WebCore. Guess Sony didn't really care about this (they wrote the curl backend). History will be saved, that's a given. Tabs won't be required since there'll be filtering and sorting instead.

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Thank you.

First of all, many thanks for the insight into what's intended, ideal, and may yet be implemented, and for your super-fast reply on the subject - as usual.

Will it be possible to save a webpage as a PDF, as with OWB, as I find that very handy, so a document can be saved for future reference/printing if required?

Will there be a Quicklinks option with mini-icons+editable name?

Will there be an option to load a Bookmark directly into its own new Tab from the Bookmarks, which cannot be done with OWB, though it is allowed from the Quicklinks with the right mouse button, though ideally it should also be possible from the middle-mouse button, as a 2-stage process to launch a new Tab is a somewhat unnecessary.

Will the webpage mini-icon be saved in the Bookmarks as it does in the Quicklinks, but which doesn't happen in the Bookmarks with OWB?

I'll miss the activity LEDs not being implemented as they are useful to know a page is still loading, etc., but if there's no way to do it then it's something that we'll have to let go. If pages load quicker then it won't be needed as much.

I hope the Download manager with resume and history support will be retained in some similar way? So, there are Current | Finished | Failed Tabs to be able to resume halted downloads from where they left off, and allow some sort of history caching of those downloads, not just webpage history, which I know you are already working on.

As usual, I'm impressed with the progress you've made so far, and look forward to getting to use it in a future release of MorphOS, as soon as you're satisfied you have achieved what you set out to do. Exceptional/Outstanding work.

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There's a lot of things that OWB has that Wayfarer doesn't. In part since the WebKit doesn't support this yet, in part because I haven't had the chance to implement it in Wayfarer itself and in part because I did not even start looking into some of the stuff.

(Explainer: WebKit consists of several libs. WTF is low level stuff like containers, file I/O, threading, allocators. JSCore is the JavaScript engine. WebCore is basically all of the actual browser - that's where all of HTML, layout, CSS, networking, media, etc happens. WebKit is basically a glue between WebCore and a UI toolkit / OS. That part I'm basically writing from 0.)

I'm not going to bother with a lot of things that Fab did in OWB - Inspector being one example. Another thing that isn't happening is web activity LEDs OWB has (there's no provisioning for that in WebCore).

For some summary of what's working:

- A very recent WebKit with a standard JS interpreter with several big endian fixes. Compatibility with most websites is pretty good.
- Standard navigation controls
- Bookmarks
- Copy & paste
- Downloads (in progress, since that part isn't working well in WebCore itself)
- Very fast ad-blocking
- Per-host settings
- HTML Crypto (missing from OWB)

On the current TODO list:

- Settings UI
- History
- Sessions
- Storing passwords
- Spell checking
- Printing

On the maybe list:

- Media playback
- Composited display / GL
- JIT

As I've mentioned, compatibility is pretty good. There are sites that do not work though. Maps & Twitter being among them. These are unlikely to work anytime soon.

@ jacadcaps

Maybe now would be a good time to ask if there are some additions to Wayfarer that aren't in OWB, and vice versa?

I ask now just while there is time to ask for features to be aware of, or possibly ask for (like the tear-off window mentioned above) that might get overlooked that really are needed/wanted while you're in the development process.

Though some limitations may well be part of the New WekKit engine/Wayfarer program anyway I suppose?

Of course, I don't want to side-track you from completing it as soon as you can, as OWB's limitations are really gettng more and more apparent/troubling, reCAPTCHA, and YouTube being just a couple, not withstanding the limitations of the JavaScript core that's also making some websites inaccessible/unviewable.

Yes, that would count as such. Of course the choices regarding the navigation bar should apply to the downloads window only? I don't know if there is a special floating-window-type possible instead.

You'll be able to open a window with just the Downloads tab in and hide the navigation bar. So I guess?

@jacadcaps
Will it be possible to 'tear-off' the downloads tab later on?

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As much as I'd like that, Wayfarer regularly requires an up to date MorphOS beta to run, so this is not possible. I have to fix stuff in MUI and mui.framework to make this app possible. Once most of the UI and WebKit features I have yet to enable are there, we can look into releasing an OS update with Wayfarer included.

Looking very good indeed! Will any open beta testing be made available anytime soon?

Not all of the functionality works yet, but here's the downloads tab in Wayfarer.

Pretty impressive pace you are walking running here. Quite a far way gone already the Wayfarer

[ Editiert durch Zylesea 06.07.2020 - 00:09 ]

Im really anxious to can try this beauty.
Good job Jacadcaps!

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The UI is hardly rocket science. The fact that this is all ObjectiveC also helps speed things up - altho to get Bookmarks working I've ended up extending the mui.framework and fixing Listtree.mcc (ugh). Removed the Bookmarks window last night and refactored the class hosting the actual browser in a tab last night. Bookmarks, Settings, Downloads, etc will be accessible via wayfarer:// in regular tabs now.

@All: thank you for all the naming ideas, I really like them. Will stick to Wayfarer though.

Too bad there are already web browsers called Polaris and Osiris. The problem with naming applications is that the good names are usually already taken.

I like Polaris :)

Also, these teases are driving me nuts, I can't wait...

Wow great how it evolves.
Didn`t expect to be so fast at this stage.

For the name, how about Osiris sounds like Iris or what about Polaris because jacadcaps is spending so much time in the polar area!?!

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That's looking awesome. I've never named someone else's software before, I'm so excited lol

We left Sarajevo on Tuesday and we move into our new house in The Netherlands next week so I'll have all our stuff shipped over from the storage unit in Manchester soon, including my PowerBook and G5. Hopefully I'll have them unpacked for the next release of MorphOS including Wayfarer. QEMU just doesn't feel the same. :)

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Also japcaps cans dedicate it to someone and put the name from him or her, it is his work.

that's an interesting name :)
is there still room for suggestions? :D

Random Ideas: Webglider, Netflow, Fastflyer, Milkyway, Pathfinder, Lighty, Bounce, MoWeR (MorphOS Web Researcher),
SeaLight, Firefly

Or maybe to have a connection to IRIS it could be something like: Pupilla, EyeLens, LiteWave (LightWave) or LWB (LightWaveBrowser) <--- that's my favorite :D, Photon/PhotonBrowser

Meh, you should have called it Steven :D


Fantastic work man, can't wait to test it :)

A first look at Wayfarer.

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sounds great Thanks for the update

Hope this new browser becomes available soon, as eBay has become inaccessible now, the reCAPTCHA demon has made their site unuseable from a buyer's or seller's perspective as you cannot now sign in with OWB AFAIK.

Yes I deleted cookies, and re-started OWB, but it just won't access the site to sign in, nice to view, no use to have an account for the purposes of OWB currently, unless someone has a way to get around the reCAPTCHA issue?

UPDATE - Good News !! - Actually you can get through the reCAPTCHA dialogue, if you try to sign/log in using OWB as the browser, it then generates an older version of the reCAPTCHA window with clickable boxes that activate the checkmarks, when they are clicked correctly a text dialogue box opens below and you have to cut/paste the text (which is valid for 2 minutes) from within that window into a blank text window just below that one, and then I clicked on the "If you're having difficulties with the rendering of images on the above verification page, eBay suggests using the latest version of your browser, or an alternate browser listed in  here and once that was done I chose the link to access the sign in page, and it allowed me to, so there's hope still for OWB, but probably not much longer before it doesn't work as effectively as it used to.

[ Edited by NewSense 22.06.2020 - 23:31 ]

As a famous bullfighter said once "In two words: Im - pressive".
Fantastic work!