Will OS4Emu be Updated on futur?
  • Caterpillar
    Caterpillar
    sergius
    Posts: 40 from 2005/12/6
    Hello itix,

    I would like to know if you will continu developping OS4Emu and if there's a chance to get Amicygnix and his applications working on MoephOS.

    I write some MorphOS reviews for obligement (a french Amiga web site), I write erotic novels and a lot of other things under googledocs on My very special A1200Mini
    I'll be an Happy MorphBook user soon unfortunatly googledocs dosen't work in offline mode with OWB :-( this is why I'm searching another word processor solution.

    My PowerBook review

    Abiword running inside Amicygnix throut OS4Emu should be a solution for writing my jobs that I do on train all the time without internet ;)

    So, this is why I'm asking if OS4Emu will be Updated and if it will support Amicygnix.

    [ Edited by sergius 15.12.2011 - 19:33 ]
  • »15.12.11 - 17:25
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    xyphoid
    Posts: 870 from 2008/7/11
    From: Delaware, USA
    haha this topic pops up every so often, so stay tune for responses :-)
  • »15.12.11 - 22:00
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    connor
    Posts: 570 from 2007/7/29
    MOS devs do not want to put effort into a native X port, so don't count on an emulated one. Even if OS4Emu would support more OS4 features I doubt that Amicygnix would "simple run" because it is a complex system. And yes, I would prefer a native port. Nevertheless, I would like to see an updated OS4Emu as there are several programs than have no equivalent on MOS: TuneNet, DvPlayer, ClassAct, Mindspace, Epistula, Wordnet to name but a few.
    BTW: cool A1200 :-o
  • »15.12.11 - 22:37
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12097 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > don't count on an emulated one.

    Emulated ones (i.e. m68k) are already running on MorphOS.

    > there are several programs than have no equivalent on MOS:
    > [...] DvPlayer

    What advantages does DvPlayer have over MPlayer?

    > ClassAct

    ClassAct already runs on MorphOS and doesn't need OS4Emu.
  • »15.12.11 - 22:58
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  • Moderator
    Miky060
    Posts: 694 from 2003/2/24
    From: ITALY
    Your A1200Mini is fantastic, I've seen it some times ago and I fall in love with it!

    PegasosII "Elite" Machine --> PowerMac MDD "popular" Machine --> MacMini 1.5 "still more popular" Machine
  • »15.12.11 - 23:14
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    connor
    Posts: 570 from 2007/7/29
    Emulated as in "OS4Emu"lated.

    http://dvplayer.amigarevolution.com/

    ClassAct is the old name, ReAction is the new one. Of course it was about new classes from OS4 that most OS4 programs need, not old ones.
  • »15.12.11 - 23:35
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12097 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> What advantages does DvPlayer have over MPlayer?

    > http://dvplayer.amigarevolution.com/

    I know that site. My question to you was what the DvPlayer features are that you miss in MPlayer.

    > ClassAct is the old name, ReAction is the new one.

    I was aware of that.
  • »15.12.11 - 23:52
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    connor
    Posts: 570 from 2007/7/29
    > I know that site.

    Then read it to see what is missing.

    > I was aware of that.

    Then don't say it is not needed. New programs need it and just some classes are working emulated.
  • »16.12.11 - 01:01
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12097 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Then read it to see what is missing.

    I only found the skinnable GUI feature. Is there anything more?

    >>>> ClassAct already runs on MorphOS and doesn't need OS4Emu.

    >>> ClassAct is the old name, ReAction is the new one.

    >> I was aware of that.

    > Then don't say it is not needed.

    I stick to my assertion that OS4Emu isn't required for running ClassAct on MorphOS. ReAction is not only a new name but also a newer version of the GUI toolkit that exists for OS3 and as a more recent version for OS4, while ClassAct is OS3 only. I'll even extend my assertion by saying that OS3 ReAction runs fine on MorphOS without OS4Emu, and that still isn't saying anything about OS4 native ReAction :-P
  • »16.12.11 - 01:22
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  • Fab
  • MorphOS Developer
    Fab
    Posts: 1331 from 2003/6/16
    @connor

    some anterior version of DVPlayer (0.65) ran with OS4emu, but anyway, you fail to tell us precisely what DVPlayer can offer compared to MPLayer. MPlayer has tons of features and options not available in DVPlayer, and plays literally hundreds more formats and codecs. Compared to DVPlayer running in OS4Emu or OS4.1 update 3, it's also significantly faster... As andreas wrote, i think the only thing that MPlayer wouldn't have is skin support, and i don't really think it's a priority.

    About X11, there are a couple X servers available already : geekgadgets X11 (that recompiles directly for PPC if wanted), XAmi (faster because if has some basic blitter support) and Amiwin. OS4 amicygnix actually uses a recompilation of the old (15 years old) Geekgadgets X11 server, that is really dog slow (no acceleration at all).
    And regarding the apps, i once compiled all that X11 stuff up to GTK2 and Enlightenment. Worked relatively fine, except for the total alien look and typical X11 slowness. Porting higher level applications was a bit more tricky, because it would have needed a working pthread implementation for ixemul, and we don't have that. So the alternative would be to recompile all this X11 crap with libnix, but it is significantly more work, and it's not worth the effort, really.


    [ Edited by Fab 16.12.2011 - 02:52 ]
  • »16.12.11 - 03:35
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  • Moderator
    hooligan
    Posts: 1948 from 2003/2/23
    From: Lahti, Finland
    @A Wolf

    Code:
    What advantages does DvPlayer have over MPlayer?


    It costs money bringing revenue to the developer, hence making him able to buy beer which makes him happy.
    www.mikseri.net/hooligan <- Free music
  • »16.12.11 - 06:19
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  • MorphOS Developer
    itix
    Posts: 1520 from 2003/2/24
    From: Finland
    Hi sergius,

    Amicygnix uses OS4 shared objects and I dont think I'll bother with that. MorphOS has built-in support for shared objects but since OS4Emu is using custom ELF loader I can't reuse existing framework. I would have to write .so loader from scratch.

    It would be easier just recompile Amicygnix or the original GeekGadgets X11 to MorphOS. It would be more efficient since it could utilize native MorphOS libraries better.
    1 + 1 = 3 with very large values of 1
  • »16.12.11 - 09:00
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  • Caterpillar
    Caterpillar
    sergius
    Posts: 40 from 2005/12/6
    Miky060,
    Quote:

    Your A1200Mini is fantastic, I've seen it some times ago and I fall in love with it!

    Thank you Miky060 :-)

    What I'm searching for is not specialy to get X11 stuff, but a reel word processor able to edit a few hundred pages without crashing all 5 minutes like WordWorth.

    I know MorphOS Team doesn't like X11 and I understand their position this is why I'm not searching to get Abiword with a native X11 port.
    I was just whishing to be able to use the OS4 one. It would be ok for my jobs.

    Itix, I understand what you explained.
    Unfortunatly, I dont know people having the good skills to do a native X11 port.

    It's sad because we have lot of interesting media applications like Blender, like Mplayer, like ShowGirl but we dont have a simple word processor working fine :(


    [ Edited by sergius 16.12.2011 - 10:37 ]
  • »16.12.11 - 10:31
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Posts: 423 from 2005/4/9
    From: magyarorszag/h...
    sergius: have you tried zoho (https://docs.zoho.com)?
    works fine in owb, better than googlidocs
    i guess - plus it aint googli after all:)
    its a free full featured, usable - even on morphos
    in a (sorry, THE:) browser - online office suit.
    worth a try for those who havent done so yet.
    DEAD pegII/G4@1000.1gb ram.radeon 9200pro
    240 gigz hd.nec dvdrw.MorphOS 2.4 DEAD
    -=-=-=-
    amiga1200T.blizzardppc@180/040@25.96megz ram
    -=-=-=-=-
    zx.spectrum@3.5
  • »16.12.11 - 12:01
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    xyphoid
    Posts: 870 from 2008/7/11
    From: Delaware, USA
    these online conversion/options are just that...online, and they don't really do jutice or accurate enough look.
    zoho however seems to be the best. I would rather be independent of opoening my browser which generally sits with 20+
    tabs at any given time
  • »16.12.11 - 12:25
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12097 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > sergius: have you tried zoho (https://docs.zoho.com)?
    > [...] its a [...] online office suit.

    In the thread opening posting sergius says he needs one that works without Internet access because he wants to use it while riding the train.
  • »16.12.11 - 13:08
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Posts: 423 from 2005/4/9
    From: magyarorszag/h...
    sorry, obviously i havent read it... but it aint hurt to mention it even if it doesnt help him in that case - well, actually it can if the train has net access which he can connect to:)
    (andreas, in case he already told at the opening that the train doesnt have any net access, please dont bother to point it out:)
    DEAD pegII/G4@1000.1gb ram.radeon 9200pro
    240 gigz hd.nec dvdrw.MorphOS 2.4 DEAD
    -=-=-=-
    amiga1200T.blizzardppc@180/040@25.96megz ram
    -=-=-=-=-
    zx.spectrum@3.5
  • »16.12.11 - 13:55
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 12097 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > obviously i havent read it... [...] it doesnt help him in that case

    True.

    > actually it can if the train has net access which he can connect to:)

    If that was an option for him I think he wouldn't have asked for an offline solution.
  • »16.12.11 - 14:45
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    _ThEcRoW
    Posts: 298 from 2008/10/27
    An update for os4emu will be interesting. 8-) ;-) Any dates?
    Mac Mini G4 1,4ghz 1gb ram & MorphOS 3.11
  • »16.12.11 - 20:11
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  • MorphOS Developer
    itix
    Posts: 1520 from 2003/2/24
    From: Finland
    _ThEcRoW,

    Not for a while at least. I currently can't contribute to MorphOS development (no access to Morph machines and source code) and when I can resume development I must finish new SDL release first...
    1 + 1 = 3 with very large values of 1
  • »17.12.11 - 20:25
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    connor
    Posts: 570 from 2007/7/29
    @ Fab

    I did not fail anything. Don't blame other people and urge them to justify themselves just because they want to use another program than your favourite. I gave the link to read what's missing. If he cannot read it, well, not my problem. Naming them again won't make a more compatible version available, either. OS4Emu was a gift. If it ever gets updated to make use of software that we are missing - fine. If not, I have to use other than MOS systems for my needs.

    It is clear that emulation always slows down a bit. That doesn't mean it gets unusable. I preferred a slowed down emulated MindSpace ten times over not having one at all. Yes, best would be a native program but there is none.
  • »19.12.11 - 20:23
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  • Fab
  • MorphOS Developer
    Fab
    Posts: 1331 from 2003/6/16
    @connor

    Your link just shows a changelog, not what's missing precisely. So, since you seem to have found missing things already, would you be so kind as to save us some time and share them?

    From 0.58 to 0.76, these are the only relevant items i cound find:
    - Added audio scope effect when playing audio-only files.
    - Added transparency (alpha channel) support for skins making it possible to have shaped windows and other transparency effects (but we already stated the lack of skin support before).

    Any thing else? Or maybe you also want to include all the bugs and missing functionality exclusive to DVPlayer, in which case we certainly lack a lot, according to this changelog. :)

    And speaking of mindspace... There are also vectorial drawing programs in MorphOS (steamdraw, ink-something and possibly more).


    [ Edited by Fab 19.12.2011 - 21:08 ]
  • »19.12.11 - 21:58
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    connor
    Posts: 570 from 2007/7/29
    @ Fab

    Yes, please give us all bugfixes to dvPlayer for your port of MPlayer, too, but leave out the features. You should also add latest bugfixes to LibreOffice, Paint.NET, Typo3 and VirtualBox, too, but again, please leave out the features.

    A lot of AIFF and WAV files are not played with MOS' MPlayer although it claims to do so. It just says "Playing" for a second and no sound is heard. Ambient internal play command (double click) can play them. dvPlayer can play them. Same goes for several videos that just appear with green blocks on MPlayer while dvPlayer plays them just fine. Other mp3 and wav files (like sound files from LEO) arenot played from the beginning but start in the middle. DvPlayer can play them. Ambient also cnanot play them and cuts the beginning.
    Throwing files on MPlayer window only plays them when thrown at the top area, not at the bottom area.
    No Unicode subtitles. Only trashed characters. Works with MPlayer on Windows, works with dvPlayer.
    Is multimedia keyboard volume adjustment supported? Did not find anything about it.
    Other missing features you found yourself. Also, the information, playlist ... windows have no shadow borders anymore when put on top of player window playing a movie. It is just a big black stripe around the window.

    Mindspace is more than just a simple vector program like Steamdraw and MagicalInk. Mindmapping, flow charts, UML modelling and the like. Sure it cannot compete MindManager, SmartDraw and such. But it is the only software that is available for Amiga (besides old and a little buggy drawStudio - although I loved this program in the old days. Sadly, support for this has stopped). You don't want to do this with MagicalInk or Steamdraw.

    BTW: there is something wrong with OWB clipboard support. I write my comments offline and then paste them here. But I only get the last line pasted into OWB. All the text before the last line does not get inserted. In any other program this works. I get the whole paragraphs, multiple paragraphs ... what ever I copied to the clipboard pasted to the textfield: YAM, Ed, Shell, ... Only OWB cuts it. This is both for 1.15 and 1.16 (don't know about older ones). Have to copy all the text line by line. I really hate it.
  • »30.12.11 - 15:05
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  • Fab
  • MorphOS Developer
    Fab
    Posts: 1331 from 2003/6/16
    @connor

    Ah, at least a more detailed answer. Good.

    Quote:


    Yes, please give us all bugfixes to dvPlayer for your port of MPlayer, too, but leave out the features.



    Well, if there were similar bugs in MPlayer in the first place, i might consider it. And the same way, if DVPlayer had more features (except for the ones we mentioned, i.e skin and audio scope), i might consider them too.

    So, about your sounds not playing, it seems they have something in common : they're short. This is indeed a bug in the mplayer audio output with such small files (the last chunk (<32k or so) isn't played). On the other hand, i'd be curious to see longer ones not being played, really. I'm also very curious to have a link to these video files giving green blocks.

    No idea about your issue with drag'n' drop. Files are appended to playlist and played wherever it's dropped in the mplayer area (and when dropped to the playlist window, they're only appended to the playlist, not played just yet).

    There's definitely support for unicode subtitles (and several formats are supported). Use -fontconfig and/or -ass subtitle output, and also set the codepage (-subcp) if needed. I have read video files with japanese subtitles without trouble.

    Media keys aren't supported directly, but you can always map a poseidon action and invoke the desired rexx command on MPlayer (rxcmd MPLAYER.1 "pause" / "volume -1" / "volume +1"...). That being said, it could easily be added to MPlayer itself. Good suggestion.

    The shadow effect can't work over an overlay layer, but it has nothing to do with MPlayer itself.

    And on the other hand, compared to DVPlayer, MPlayer is faster, supports hundreds more codecs and formats, supports all kinds of transports (streaming over many protocols mms/http/ftp/rtp/rtsp/... ), has many video/audio filters, handles metadata, has playlist support and management (which allows more than just appending), allows to record streams, and much much more.

    Regarding OWB and your paste issue, feel free to send me a text file showing that issue (my guess is it probably happens with some specific character), because I can't reproduce here (i pasted a couple big source files in this very textarea to try, and got it all each time).
  • »30.12.11 - 18:44
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