Hints and rumoured sightings of the very shy 3.10
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 8984 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > alot of argueing about something neither of you knows (on which cards bigfoot
    > works in which order and in what timeframe)

    I was arguing about which graphics cards most MorphOS-interested current and future Sam460 or X5000 owners most probably want supported sooner than later. And I was arguing against Jim's original proposition of working all the way up through every Radeon generation before starting work on supporting cards that would be best for the mentioned target group. I was certainly not arguing about "on which cards bigfoot works in which order and in what timeframe", because, as you say, I simply don't know "on which cards bigfoot works in which order and in what timeframe".

    > that won't change a bit

    This goes for the majority of arguing on the WWW, doesn't it? :-) But wait, our arguing did change a bit, namely that Jim will now include a GCN-based card into his shipment to bigfoot :-)
  • »08.01.17 - 22:23
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 8984 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > I can get 4450s cheaper.

    ;-)

    > I don't even know if they received cards with the X5000s, but I doubt it.
    > And if they did, were they similar to what is being included now?

    Most probably not.

    > Then all we'll have to worry about is GCN2, 3, and 4. That, AND the fact that we could
    > use an OpenGL upgrade.

    Indeed.
  • »08.01.17 - 22:44
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 3955 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    @ Andreas,

    Agreed, our primary disagreement is based on how we think this should be approached.
    I don't really care if Mark wants to work on the earlier cards first (I don't even know what his plans are in regard to the GCN cards, except that he mentioned it would be awhile before those were supported).
    If you guys want to push for more focus on the latter cards, by all means do so, I'm happy to wait.
    And being a hardware head, I'd be happy upgrading as newer cards were supported.
    "Fiery the angels rose, and as they rose deep thunder roll'd / Around their shores: indignant burning with the fires of Orc."

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »08.01.17 - 22:48
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 8984 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > The only statement I got on GCN is that it would be awhile. [...]
    > I wouldn't expect GCN support with 3.10.

    I think nobody really does.
  • »08.01.17 - 22:52
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 3955 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > The only statement I got on GCN is that it would be awhile. [...]
    > I wouldn't expect GCN support with 3.10.

    I think nobody really does.


    Yep, I don't ever remember hearing it was to be included, I'm just happy to know its in the developer's sights.
    I chaff at the bit as much as anyone, as I've already mentioned with my constant waffling on whether or not to settle for the dual core X5000.

    But it will be cool, I just have to have patience, and I should eventually have a four core X5000 with a GCN based video card to round out my PPC collection.

    Then I can wait for how ever long it takes to make the move to X64, WITH some damned cool hardware.

    I do wish there were some SAM460s to be had though, it would make a good 'appetizer'.

    I have received absolutely zero response from Acube when inquiring about that board.

    [ Edited by Jim 08.01.2017 - 18:00 ]
    "Fiery the angels rose, and as they rose deep thunder roll'd / Around their shores: indignant burning with the fires of Orc."

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »08.01.17 - 23:59
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    NewSense
    Posts: 503 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, Gr...
    In Frying Pan the DVD±R/W UJ-875 drive is found, and I can use it to write DVD±R/W discs, but it won't recognise DL discs it seems, so does anyone know if Jalapeno can use/write to DL discs, or Frying Pan, as I don't seem to be able to find any docs that indicate if it/they can/not?

    I mention this as I put a DL DVD in my Matsushita (Panasonic) UJ-875, which is a DL DVD recorder/reader and I could see the disk listed on Ambient/MyMorphOS, but I couldn't get it to open or be read via MPlayer as that too could not 'see' the disc to open the disc files it seems.

    I just wondered if anyone knows if Dual-Layer (DL) DVD drives and recording disks to them is supported with any software with MorphOS currently, and reading from them, or if it will be supported in future releases?

    Might Blu-ray be supported at any time in the future - is it in any 'future-roadmap'?
    Mac Mini 1.5GHz, Model 10.2, 64MB VRam, 250GB HDD, 1GB RAM, Airport, Bluetooth, Wireless Keyboard & Mouse, DVD-RW-DL+CD-RW, Iomega MiniMax, Belkin 6 port 3 x Firewire/3 x USB2, MorphOS 3.9, Mac OS X 10.4 & 10.5 & A1138 Powerbook MOS v3.9, Model 5,8
  • »09.01.17 - 03:56
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  • MorphOS Developer
    geit
    Posts: 880 from 2004/9/23
    Quote:

    NewSense wrote:

    Might Blu-ray be supported at any time in the future - is it in any 'future-roadmap'?


    Well, I may be supported right now. Jalapeno is "just" a gui for OpenSource based components.

    Check for the tools delivered in MOSSYS:Data/Jalapeno/. cdrecord already seems to support BR.

    The problem is in any case that you need a proper source file system to prepare the data to burn. Reading files
    from a Bluray is probably an issue as it needs a different file system from what I remember.

    However I wont hold my breath for any more in that direction, as optical media for storage is quite dead these days.
    There are faster and cheaper ways to store data these days. Playing movies is another problem due the encryption.
  • »09.01.17 - 12:20
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 3955 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    geit wrote:
    Quote:

    NewSense wrote:

    Might Blu-ray be supported at any time in the future - is it in any 'future-roadmap'?


    Well, I may be supported right now. Jalapeno is "just" a gui for OpenSource based components.

    Check for the tools delivered in MOSSYS:Data/Jalapeno/. cdrecord already seems to support BR.

    The problem is in any case that you need a proper source file system to prepare the data to burn. Reading files
    from a Bluray is probably an issue as it needs a different file system from what I remember.

    However I wont hold my breath for any more in that direction, as optical media for storage is quite dead these days.
    There are faster and cheaper ways to store data these days. Playing movies is another problem due the encryption.


    Hmm... I will agree that optical media is dying, but dead?
    I just picked up a 10 pack of DVD-R discs a couple of days ago because I wanted an easier to use boot medium than a USB key (for upgrading a laptop to Win10).
    Of course, if the laptop didn't have a DVD drive (like my own without the dockng station)...

    I must admit, I like optical media.
    If blu ray discs had a reduced size instead of more storage than I need, I might consider that move.
    But let's face it, USB drives are nice, small and pocketable.

    The primary disadvantage?
    I don't just give away a thumb drive.

    I have no problem with giving away optical media.
    "Fiery the angels rose, and as they rose deep thunder roll'd / Around their shores: indignant burning with the fires of Orc."

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »09.01.17 - 12:40
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 8984 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Reading files from a Bluray [...] needs a different file system from what I remember.

    Yes, UDF 2.50+.
  • »09.01.17 - 13:55
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  • MorphOS Developer
    jacadcaps
    Posts: 1462 from 2003/3/5
    From: Canada
    Quote:

    NewSense wrote:
    I just wondered if anyone knows if Dual-Layer (DL) DVD drives and recording disks to them is supported with any software with MorphOS currently, and reading from them, or if it will be supported in future releases?

    Might Blu-ray be supported at any time in the future - is it in any 'future-roadmap'?


    DL should burn just fine with Jalapeno's cdrecord backend. *Afair* BD is enabled as well - you just wouldn't be able to read the BD on MorphOS afterwards.
  • »09.01.17 - 16:22
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    NewSense
    Posts: 503 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, Gr...
    Quote:

    jacadcaps wrote: 'DL should burn just fine with Jalapeno's CDrecord backend......'

    However, that doesn't answer the problem I have with a standard DVD+R DL disc with video material on it that my Sony DVR could play as standard, but that MPlayer couldn't access and that Frying Pan couldn't burn/find it as a useable DL DVD+R disc with it inserted in my UJ-875 Dual-Layer DVD±R/W drive.

    Either the system does handle this media, or it doesn't, a 'fudged' answer is not of much use to anyone using MorphOS, is it?

    If someone on the Dev Team can give a comprehensive Yes or No answer, and information on whether this issue is being, or going to be addressed in the future (near or far) then that would be what I was hoping to know, thanks.
    Mac Mini 1.5GHz, Model 10.2, 64MB VRam, 250GB HDD, 1GB RAM, Airport, Bluetooth, Wireless Keyboard & Mouse, DVD-RW-DL+CD-RW, Iomega MiniMax, Belkin 6 port 3 x Firewire/3 x USB2, MorphOS 3.9, Mac OS X 10.4 & 10.5 & A1138 Powerbook MOS v3.9, Model 5,8
  • »09.01.17 - 16:49
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  • MorphOS Developer
    jacadcaps
    Posts: 1462 from 2003/3/5
    From: Canada
    Quote:

    NewSense wrote:
    Either the system does handle this media, or it doesn't, a 'fudged' answer is not of much use to anyone using MorphOS, is it?
    If someone on the Dev Team can give a comprehensive Yes or No answer, and information on whether this issue is being, or going to be addressed in the future (near or far) then that would be what I was hoping to know, thanks.


    Neither FryingPan nor mplayer are part of the system, are they? I wish I could give you a yes/no regarding Jalapeno, but I do not currently have a DL-capable burner, so there's no way for me to verify things. It's been a couple of years since I worked on this...
  • »09.01.17 - 16:59
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    NewSense
    Posts: 503 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, Gr...
    OK, I appreciate your very quick reply, but if someone in the Dev Team can actually answer this question, when they get a free moment to do so I'd be very grateful.

    I, as a MOS user, mistakenly take it for granted that MPlayer is basically part of MorphOS, as is Frying Pan, though I know Frying Pan was never authored by anyone on the Dev Team, but MPlayer has been worked on by others who are, AFAIK, but they are an often associated with being an intrinsic part of the useablility of MorphOS as a whole, but I will bear in mind they aren't part of MOS as such in the future.
    Mac Mini 1.5GHz, Model 10.2, 64MB VRam, 250GB HDD, 1GB RAM, Airport, Bluetooth, Wireless Keyboard & Mouse, DVD-RW-DL+CD-RW, Iomega MiniMax, Belkin 6 port 3 x Firewire/3 x USB2, MorphOS 3.9, Mac OS X 10.4 & 10.5 & A1138 Powerbook MOS v3.9, Model 5,8
  • »09.01.17 - 17:16
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 3955 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    A stupid question, but you DO have a dual layer capable drive, don't you?
    The majority of the machines we now support did not come with dual layer compatible optical drives, and most of DVD drives I have seen that support this feature have an SATA interface.

    Just checking...
    "Fiery the angels rose, and as they rose deep thunder roll'd / Around their shores: indignant burning with the fires of Orc."

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »09.01.17 - 17:56
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    NewSense
    Posts: 503 from 2012/11/10
    From: Manchester, Gr...
    Quote:

    Jim wrote: A stupid question, but you DO have a dual layer capable drive, don't you? .... Just checking...

    Did you read this thread .... yet another stupid question! ;-)

    As you haven't read - comment #61 by me "...useable DL DVD+R disc with it inserted in my UJ-875 Dual-Layer DVD±R/W drive." 8-D
    Mac Mini 1.5GHz, Model 10.2, 64MB VRam, 250GB HDD, 1GB RAM, Airport, Bluetooth, Wireless Keyboard & Mouse, DVD-RW-DL+CD-RW, Iomega MiniMax, Belkin 6 port 3 x Firewire/3 x USB2, MorphOS 3.9, Mac OS X 10.4 & 10.5 & A1138 Powerbook MOS v3.9, Model 5,8
  • »09.01.17 - 18:43
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  • Cocoon
    Cocoon
    Posts: 51 from 2016/3/9
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    Looking through the offerings of the various X5000 distributors I can see that each of them bundles different cards with the system. It's apparently not like A-Eon is stipulating which card to sell with X5000 systems, as long as they are supported by Warp3D Nova.


    Part of the problem as I understand it from talking to Amiga on the Lake is what the dealer is getting from A-eon and what they are not. He said that he had to find the Fusion cases, video cards, RAM, drives, basically it sounds like all he is getting from A-eon is the motherboard, case front and OS license. He is burning the OS discs himself.

    He said the particular Fusion cases are almost extinct, in the US at least. He called everywhere and apparently got every one available in the US - something like 27 cases and that's it.


    They must be selling fairly well, for a super expensive, teeny tiny market like the Amiga :) After mine he said that he has only 2 cases left.
  • »12.01.17 - 03:38
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  • Cocoon
    Cocoon
    Posts: 51 from 2016/3/9
    Ok, all this talk about video cards, SAM460, X5000, etc has got me wondering how much I really don't know that I don't know :)

    Say you download version X of MorphOS. On the hardware supported page is listed motherboards / systems A, B and C and video cards V1, V2 and V3. Does that mean in the MorphOS world that every combination of motherboard & video card is supported or only some combinations?

    From some of the discussion in this thread, much of it honestly flying right past me, I'm getting the idea that this might not be the case. Am I understanding correctly that some combinations, particularly the SAM460 and various video cards, are not supported?

    I know that sounds like a really stupid question since right there in the hardware supported list, they are all listed as supported. In some other threads I was reading that supporting some cards on the sam was troublesome. Has that changed?

    As before, the main reason is that I would like to run MorphOS on both the Sam and X5000 and am trying to find a card that is supported by all OSes I'm wanting to try. Not that I expect the fastest MorphOS performance from either (that's what the Macs are for), simply for the convenience.
  • »12.01.17 - 03:51
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 8984 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Does that mean in the MorphOS world that every combination of
    > motherboard & video card is supported or only some combinations?

    There are compatibility restrictions like slot type, voltage, BIOS type, presence of bridge chip etc.

    > I would like to run MorphOS on both the Sam and X5000 and am trying
    > to find a card that is supported by all OSes I'm wanting to try.

    Regarding X5000: not yet supported by MorphOS. Wait for 3.10 and see what will have changed in terms of graphics card support.
    Regarding Sam460: Use an R500-based Radeon (X1300 to X1950). R500 is well supported by MorphOS (including 3D) and mediocrely supported by OS4 (including Compositing, but no 3D).
  • »12.01.17 - 08:24
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 3955 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    NewSense wrote:
    Quote:

    Jim wrote: A stupid question, but you DO have a dual layer capable drive, don't you? .... Just checking...

    Did you read this thread .... yet another stupid question! ;-)

    As you haven't read - comment #61 by me "...useable DL DVD+R disc with it inserted in my UJ-875 Dual-Layer DVD±R/W drive." 8-D


    Hey, I told you it was a stupid question. ;-)
    "Fiery the angels rose, and as they rose deep thunder roll'd / Around their shores: indignant burning with the fires of Orc."

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »12.01.17 - 11:31
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    polluks
    Posts: 261 from 2007/10/23
    From: Gelsenkirchen,...
    Quote:

    Jupp3 schrieb:
    Quote:

    ASiegel wrote:
    But these represent a tiny fraction of the available content and this is not going to drastically change within a year or two.

    So when 3.10 is released, everyone has switched already?

    ...just kidding about the release date (I hope...) :-P


    You made my day :-)
    We just left out some steps, directly from SD to UHD.
    Pegasos II G4: MorphOS 3.9, Zalman M220W
    Power Mac G3: OSX 10.3 · PowerBook 5,8: OSX 10.5, MorphOS 3.9
  • »04.02.17 - 11:03
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 8984 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > We just left out some steps, directly from SD to UHD.

    No problem playing high-profile H264 in 720p here :-)
  • »04.02.17 - 12:19
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 3955 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    > We just left out some steps, directly from SD to UHD.

    No problem playing high-profile H264 in 720p here :-)


    Or on a PowerMac G4 with a 1.33GHz processor card, or a 1.42 GHz iBook here (let alone a G5).

    I'd still like some form of gpu assisted decoding to get the cpu load down though (or how about off-loading that to a second core when present).
    "Fiery the angels rose, and as they rose deep thunder roll'd / Around their shores: indignant burning with the fires of Orc."

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »08.02.17 - 03:55
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 8984 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> No problem playing high-profile H264 in 720p here :-)

    > Or on a PowerMac G4 with a 1.33GHz processor card, or a 1.42 GHz iBook here

    High-profile H264 in 720p didn't work too well on my 1.5 GHz Mac mini.

    > let alone a G5

    Yes, that's what "here" means :-)
  • »08.02.17 - 09:19
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  • Jim
  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Jim
    Posts: 3955 from 2009/1/28
    From: Delaware, USA
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    >> No problem playing high-profile H264 in 720p here :-)

    > Or on a PowerMac G4 with a 1.33GHz processor card, or a 1.42 GHz iBook here

    High-profile H264 in 720p didn't work too well on my 1.5 GHz Mac mini.

    > let alone a G5

    Yes, that's what "here" means :-)


    Really? Can you send me the file you tried so I can check it out?
    Since I doubt the video in your Mac Mini seriously affects playback, you have made me curious.
    I've actually tried files with high resolutions than this on the G5, and I'm curious to see if what you tried playing produces similar results in G4's with plug-in video cards.

    But your results do back up the contention that we needs gpu assisted video decoding.
    "Fiery the angels rose, and as they rose deep thunder roll'd / Around their shores: indignant burning with the fires of Orc."

    "Never attribute to malice what can more readily explained by incompetence"
  • »08.02.17 - 11:19
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Cool_amigaN
    Posts: 432 from 2011/11/30
    1080p H264/x264 mkv are being played flawless on G5 2.5Ghz. 720p h264 mkv are okish on PMac 3.1 G4 1.6Ghz. Buffering when skipping forward/backward is a problem but I assume that is caused due to the very slow and old IDE HD interface of my main system. Streaming over lan from a NAS is ok too. Highly compressed MP4 are usually proved to be a problem on the other hand.
    Amiga gaming Tribute: Watch, rate, comment :)
  • »08.02.17 - 13:17
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