MorphZone

WINE for MorphOS???

amigadave

# 1
Yokemate of Keyboards

Posts: 2794 from 2006/3/21

From: Northern Calif...

Has anyone thought about trying to make something like WINE for MorphOS, so we could run some of the millions of Windows applications and games in some limited way?

We have emulators for many other systems (mostly game consoles) including DOS_Box to run some pre-Windows software, and WINE for Linux has been around for many years, so I would be surprised if no one has thought of creating a port of WINE (which is obviously impossible or it would have already been tried), or created a different emulator that would allow SOME Windows software to be run under MorphOS.

I suppose that the Endianess difference might be a big part of the reason it hasn't been done, but that was solved for DOS_Box so maybe it isn't part of why there is no way to run any Windows software thru an emulator of some kind on MorphOS. I don't want to run any version of Windows, just some of the Windows software that can't otherwise be ported to MorphOS for any reason.

I suppose that it also has not been accomplished because such a translator or emulator might run too slowly on our limited PPC systems. It sure would be great to be able to run just a few of my essential Windows software applications on MorphOS, as I really hate dealing with all the problems Windows continues to have, after all these years, and on hardware that should (but doesn't when running Windows) blow away all of my other Amiga and MorphOS systems.

I realize that this is probably a pointless discussion, but I was a little surprised that I couldn't find any previous threads on this forum site which mentioned this topic.
MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
»23.01.16 - 00:32

Andreas_Wolf

# 2
Yokemate of Keyboards

Posts: 12074 from 2003/5/22

From: Germany

> I was a little surprised that I couldn't find any previous threads
> on this forum site which mentioned this topic.

Me too :-)

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=9086&forum=9
https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=11042&forum=3
»23.01.16 - 00:51

amigadave

# 3
Yokemate of Keyboards

Posts: 2794 from 2006/3/21

From: Northern Calif...

Quote:

Andreas_Wolf wrote:
> I was a little surprised that I couldn't find any previous threads
> on this forum site which mentioned this topic.

Me too

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=9086&forum=9
https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=11042&forum=3

Those results did not show up when I used WINE in the search field. You are obviously a master at searching beyond my capabilities.
MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
»23.01.16 - 04:57

Andreas_Wolf

# 4
Yokemate of Keyboards

Posts: 12074 from 2003/5/22

From: Germany

> Those results did not show up when I used WINE in the search field.

They are on pages 2 and 3, respectively, of the forum search results.
»23.01.16 - 05:59

bigfoot

# 5
MorphOS Developer

Posts: 508 from 2003/4/11

Well, there are several issues at hand. First of all, you'd need a very high speed/high quality x86 emulator for PowerPC. Such a beast simply doesn't exist currently, at least not in the open source world, so that would have to be made first. Such an emulator would also have to include full MMU support, majorly slowing down memory accesses. This alone wouldn't exactly be a trivial project.

Next up, WINE itself expects to run on a Unix-ish system. That gives you 3 ways of moving forwards:
1) Try to modify WINE to rely less on Unix-ish systems. Not a trivial task.
2) Try to modify MorphOS to act more like a Unix-ish system, or create some layer that would do so. Not a trivial task either.
3) Skip WINE and reimplement Windows yourself. Obviously not a trivial task either.

So yeah, it's not that anyone hasn't thought about it, it's just that such a project would be a major software project, something nobody would have time for even if they had the skills to do it.
I rarely log in to MorphZone which means that I often miss private messages sent on here. If you wish to contact me, please email me at [username]@asgaard.morphos-team.net, where [username] is my username here on MorphZone.
»23.01.16 - 09:39

Zylesea

# 6
Yokemate of Keyboards

Posts: 2053 from 2003/6/4

Quote:

amigadave schrieb:
Has anyone thought about trying to make something like WINE for MorphOS, so we could run some of the millions of Windows applications and games in some limited way?

We have emulators for many other systems (mostly game consoles) including DOS_Box to run some pre-Windows software, and WINE for Linux has been around for many years, so I would be surprised if no one has thought of creating a port of WINE (which is obviously impossible or it would have already been tried), or created a different emulator that would allow SOME Windows software to be run under MorphOS.

I suppose that the Endianess difference might be a big part of the reason it hasn't been done, but that was solved for DOS_Box so maybe it isn't part of why there is no way to run any Windows software thru an emulator of some kind on MorphOS. I don't want to run any version of Windows, just some of the Windows software that can't otherwise be ported to MorphOS for any reason.

I suppose that it also has not been accomplished because such a translator or emulator might run too slowly on our limited PPC systems. It sure would be great to be able to run just a few of my essential Windows software applications on MorphOS, as I really hate dealing with all the problems Windows continues to have, after all these years, and on hardware that should (but doesn't when running Windows) blow away all of my other Amiga and MorphOS systems.

I realize that this is probably a pointless discussion, but I was a little surprised that I couldn't find any previous threads on this forum site which mentioned this topic.

WINE is an API wrapper not an emulator (hence the name). If WINE were ported you could run programs that use the Windows API, but no x86 binaries as there is no x86 present to run the actual binary. One would need an additional x86 emulator and MorphOS would need to schedule x86 binaries to that x86 processor emulator. Endianess issues are probably not a general show stopper as Windows binaries wouldn't access MorphOS structures directly, but via WINE. But it would probaly add some overhead A port of WINE would be quite some work though. And the required x86 emulator makes it rather slow
So far quite much work for what benefit?

Better approch: emulate a complete pc (like with DOS Box) and run Windows on it. Even better approch: use an actual Windows pc or Linux x86+WINE directly or via a remote desktop session.

For MorphOS x64 WINE would make quite a some sense though (no processor emulation required) IMHO.
--
http://via.bckrs.de

Whenever you're sad just remember the world is 4.543 billion years old and you somehow managed to exist at the same time as David Bowie.
...and Matthias , my friend - RIP
»23.01.16 - 09:44

amigadave

# 7
Yokemate of Keyboards

Posts: 2794 from 2006/3/21

From: Northern Calif...

Using a remote desktop application from my existing MorphOS desktop to access either my desktop or laptop Windows10 machines would be the best alternative for me, until something better can be achieved, hopefully when MorphOS for x64 is released.

I don't even know much of anything about WINE, or if it is Open Source, so a port to MorphOS for x64 could be attempted.

The remote desktop route is what I should be using, so I will be on my MorphOS computers more often (like all the time). That would be much more satisfying than using a Windows computer directly as much as I currently do.

Any recommendations on which software to use (assuming that there is more than one choice), and a link to a website that has easy installation and setup instructions?

From what I have read and heard, the latest version of AmigaForever/AmiKit allows a setup option to run AmigaOS3.9 hosted on an (almost) invisible Linux environment, which also allows seamless use of some or most Linux software from the AmigaOS3.9 Workbench, but I have not yet tried to set up such a system to see how well it works. It would not solve my desire to be able to run my Windows CAD software and the one Windows game I play occasionally, unless I also tried to run WINE with that AmigaOS3.9 hosted on Linux installation.
MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
»23.01.16 - 17:46

pampers

# 8
Paladin of the Pegasos

Posts: 1061 from 2009/2/26

From: Tczew, Poland

I hope we will get JS JIT soon and updated browser so maybe we can use sites like fra.me for example if there is a need to run windows software.
MorphOS 3.x
»23.01.16 - 18:04

Zylesea

# 9
Yokemate of Keyboards

Posts: 2053 from 2003/6/4

Quote:

amigadave:
Any recommendations on which software to use.

go to sys:Applications/RDesktop/

Edit: As for ease of usage. I haven't used RDesktop myself before, but just tried it now.
I added an entry for my Windows machine under preferences Hosts, created a new user on the Windows machine (with password!)and just started RDesktop. Works.
I am typing this under Opera Windows sitting in front of my Mac mini now.
And it's pretty fast - even youtube videos are working okayish (I use 800x600 for the RDesptop window). And that while the Win machine is on a 54Mb WLAN connection atthe attic (the router actually reports 44Mb). Nice!

[ Editiert durch Zylesea 23.01.2016 - 22:27 ]
--
http://via.bckrs.de

Whenever you're sad just remember the world is 4.543 billion years old and you somehow managed to exist at the same time as David Bowie.
...and Matthias , my friend - RIP
»23.01.16 - 20:05