Genesi & PowerPC
  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Drako^lM
    Posts: 136 from 2005/8/10
    From: Poland , Chelm
    From Amigaworld.net
    BBRV wrote this
    Quote:

    I just traded emails with one of the main (and surviving) Freescale engineers/manager for the Power Architecture. Recently, we have been asked about the possibility of developing a new Power based system. If you have any thoughts on potential specifications please send us an email. We will meet with the Freescale folks in early December. Any input from the Community is welcome. If there is enough interest we may create a related project on power2people.org. Who knows this might be a good reason to turn on all the lights again at PowerDeveloper.

    R&B


    I remember my good old Pegasos II & Efika .
    And if there was a chance for the creation of a new hardware produced by bplan.
    That would be "great news" .

    What do you think about it ?
    Hardware :
    Power Mac G5 2.3 Ghz & MorphOS 3.x & OSX 10.5
    Mini G4 1.5 Ghz & MorphOS 3.x
    BlaBla Team Member -> http://blabla.ppa.pl
    AmiParty Team Member -> http://www.chal.pl/
  • »10.11.15 - 18:40
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Everblue
    Posts: 163 from 2004/1/6
    I would *LOVE* a new Pegasos PPC machine, which were relatively cheap and powerful, compared to the stuff A-Eon and ACube make. Maybe this is an indirect proposition by Genesi for a new MorphOS machine? Or maybe I'm just dreaming :)
  • »10.11.15 - 18:47
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  • Moderator
    Kronos
    Posts: 1985 from 2003/2/24
    There is no point in a new "Pegasos" as none of the SoCs by Freescale is powerfull enought to hold it's water against a PowerMacG5, with only one core used probraly not even a PowerMacG4. You'll end up with something somewhere between the SAM460 and X5000.


    A new "Efika" on the other hand..... sound USB2,GBit and SATA onboard, 1 or 2GB soldered, a SoC slightly more powerfull than a Peg2 and 1 PCIe for GFX all for 150-250€ retail....

    Basicly a Tabor with all the stupid removed ;)
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »10.11.15 - 18:52
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Everblue
    Posts: 163 from 2004/1/6
    Well, it doesn't have to be called Pegasos of course :P - something more powerful like you mentioned would be ok, but please don't call it Efika 2 :P

    I agree with the Tabor comment ;)

    Edit: no point in having multicore CPUs if the OS doesn't support it

    [ Edited by Everblue 10.11.2015 - 19:56 ]
  • »10.11.15 - 18:54
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Drako^lM
    Posts: 136 from 2005/8/10
    From: Poland , Chelm
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:

    A new "Efika" on the other hand..... sound USB2,GBit and SATA onboard, 1 or 2GB soldered, a SoC slightly more powerfull than a Peg2 and 1 PCIe for GFX all for 150-250€ retail....




    With 8610 CPU on it ;)
    Hardware :
    Power Mac G5 2.3 Ghz & MorphOS 3.x & OSX 10.5
    Mini G4 1.5 Ghz & MorphOS 3.x
    BlaBla Team Member -> http://blabla.ppa.pl
    AmiParty Team Member -> http://www.chal.pl/
  • »10.11.15 - 18:59
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1078 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    There is no point in a new "Pegasos" as none of the SoCs by Freescale is powerfull enought to hold it's water against a PowerMacG5, with only one core used probraly not even a PowerMacG4. You'll end up with something somewhere between the SAM460 and X5000.


    A new "Efika" on the other hand..... sound USB2,GBit and SATA onboard, 1 or 2GB soldered, a SoC slightly more powerfull than a Peg2 and 1 PCIe for GFX all for 150-250€ retail....

    Basicly a Tabor with all the stupid removed ;)


    I'd definitely buy one of those. :)
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.9

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, OSX 10.5.8, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »10.11.15 - 19:10
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1420 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    There is no point in a new "Pegasos" as none of the SoCs by Freescale is powerfull enought to hold it's water against a PowerMacG5, with only one core used probraly not even a PowerMacG4. You'll end up with something somewhere between the SAM460 and X5000.


    A new "Efika" on the other hand..... sound USB2,GBit and SATA onboard, 1 or 2GB soldered, a SoC slightly more powerfull than a Peg2 and 1 PCIe for GFX all for 150-250€ retail....

    Basicly a Tabor with all the stupid removed ;)


    +1

    Problem is, HYPErion won't support a board without stupid built in. A-Eonkit won't admit it it, but part of the crazy markup is to pay HYPErion to port OS4. There is no other explanation. If Genesi made such a board, OS4 probably wouldn't come to it.
  • »10.11.15 - 19:12
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1420 from 2003/4/13
    All that said, I would have a lot more interest in a theoretical Pegasos III than I do a Tabor or X5000. Genesi already demonstrated that they can design a board and sell it without needing to sacrifice a first born. I got my Pesasos I w/April 2 for $299 when it first came out. That was a bundle that included a shirt and a number of games.

    [ Edited by redrumloa 10.11.2015 - 14:21 ]
  • »10.11.15 - 19:20
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Cego
    Posts: 638 from 2006/5/28
    From: Germany
    i'd love to see it happen. Genesi/bPlan always did some good hardware and their support is awesome. If they can produce a high end PPC machine at a price of the Peg2 systems back then i'd be really interested.
    Pegasos II G4 @1.0GHz, 1GB DDR Ram, Radeon 9200Pro, 160GB+500GB HD, MorphOS 3.13, AmigaOS4.1 FE, MacOS X Panther 10.3.9, Debian 8
  • »10.11.15 - 19:20
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    takemehomegrandma
    Posts: 2648 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    A new "Efika" on the other hand..... sound USB2,GBit and SATA onboard, 1 or 2GB soldered, a SoC slightly more powerfull than a Peg2 and 1 PCIe for GFX all for 150-250€ retail....

    Basicly a Tabor with all the stupid removed ;)


    I'd definitely buy one of those. :)


    +1

    :-)
    MorphOS is Amiga done right! :-)
    MorphOS NG will be AROS done right! :-)
  • »10.11.15 - 19:28
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    takemehomegrandma
    Posts: 2648 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    redrumloa wrote:

    Problem is, HYPErion won't support a board without stupid built in. A-Eonkit won't admit it it, but part of the crazy markup is to pay HYPErion to port OS4. There is no other explanation. If Genesi made such a board, OS4 probably wouldn't come to it.


    That has been the pattern...

    Maybe when it has been discontinued...
    MorphOS is Amiga done right! :-)
    MorphOS NG will be AROS done right! :-)
  • »10.11.15 - 19:31
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  • Moderator
    Kronos
    Posts: 1985 from 2003/2/24
    @red's granny

    Well offcourse nothing BBRV will be supported by HypaHypa for years to come.

    Just like nothing AEon or ACube wasn't isn't and won't be supported till years later.


    If someone could do a working PPC board at a reasonable price they will have a hard time not supporting it with a OS4-community that is actually getting more and more frustrated with progress and lack of HW choices.

    Sure thats not true for the hardcore 112,5% nutjobs, but who would want them as costumers anyways...

    [ Edited by Kronos 10.11.2015 - 21:06 ]
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »10.11.15 - 20:00
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1420 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    If someone could do a working PPC board at a reasonable price they will have a hard time not supporting it with a OS4-community that is actually getting more and more frustrated with progress and lack of HW choices.



    No, not so much. Why did Efika never get a look? Why did Project Moana get scrapped? I think a lot of people will be surprised how much the "inexpensive" Tabor will cost. Even compare a Pegasos board cost to a Sam. OS4 board have a staggering markup for a reason IMO.
  • »10.11.15 - 20:15
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  • Moderator
    Kronos
    Posts: 1985 from 2003/2/24
    @red

    It ain't 2005 anymore !! Really just have a look around in the less-nutty corners of OS4-land and you'll see.

    Noone there expects "red" HW that isn't either dog-slow, crappy and/or super expensive and people are getting fed up with it.

    Not saying that these people would buy a MorphOS-only QorIQfiKA, but Hyperion will have a harder time getting people to buy 2000$++ AEon-board that offer the same performance in reallife.
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »10.11.15 - 20:23
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1420 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    @red

    It ain't 2005 anymore !! Really just have a look around in the less-nutty corners of OS4-land and you'll see.


    I know it isn't 2005 anymore. But instead of getting more sane, A-Eonkit and HYPErion seem to be doubling down. X1000 only came out a few years ago. Was that sane?

    Quote:

    Noone there expects "red" HW that isn't either dog-slow, crappy and/or super expensive and people are getting fed up with it.


    And yet A-Eonkit is doubling down, no? I guess we need to see the final consumer price of the Tabor to know for sure. I think people expecting a $250 board with OS4 bundled will be disappointed. We'll see.

    Quote:

    Not saying that these people would buy a MorphOS-only QorIQfiKA, but Hyperion will have a harder time getting people to buy 2000$++ AEon-board that offer the same performance in reallife.


    I would think so, but A-Eonkit sure don't and their strongest supporters don't think so. I didn't expect the X1000 to sell 50, but by all accounts it sold some number north of 200, with some suggestions over 500. The X5000 will be over $2,500 and A-Eonkit will have a lot invested in it. Will HYPErion really chose to support a theoretical $300 board from Genesi over their partners?
  • »10.11.15 - 20:36
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    takemehomegrandma
    Posts: 2648 from 2003/2/24
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:

    Just like nothing AEon or ACube wasn't isn't and won't be supported till years later.



    When it comes to Aeon, chances are that a MorphOS version with X5000 support will be released before even the X5000 HW is...

    ;-)
    MorphOS is Amiga done right! :-)
    MorphOS NG will be AROS done right! :-)
  • »10.11.15 - 20:41
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  • Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    Priest of the Order of the Butterfly
    ausPPC
    Posts: 543 from 2007/8/6
    From: Pending...
    Just because MorphOS remains limited to a single core does not necessarily justify creating a similarly limited hardware design.

    If it's a low end niche they're aiming to fill, my wishlist would be something like this:

    #1 A healthy amount of on-board memory. If it's a single 32bit cpu, just give it 4GB.
    #2 The computer should run silently with no risk of overheating or at least have such a mode.
    #3 Fast msata / m2 please!
    #4 All the other obvious stuff - graphics (beyond full hd?), sound, usb, ethernet (wifi?)
    #5 Sensible phone charger style DC power rather than clunky ATX style connector.

    If they're aiming higher than that, I'd want it to be as much like a modern PC motherboard - sans competition stifling bios of course! A 64bit Pegasos 3 would be most welcome.

    [ Edited by ausPPC 11.11.2015 - 10:41 ]
    PPC assembly ain't so bad... ;)
  • »10.11.15 - 20:48
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  • Moderator
    Kronos
    Posts: 1985 from 2003/2/24
    @granny

    Regarding the X5000 I would rather bet my money on an even more "egg-in-the-face" scenario to happen ;)
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »10.11.15 - 20:54
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1420 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    @granny

    Regarding the X5000 I would rather bet my money on an even more "egg-in-the-face" scenario to happen ;)


    We'll see. It seems even some MorphOS users are interested in it. IIRC A-Eonkit advertised spending $2M in development costs. If they don't sell a buttload of them, it will be curtains for them.
  • »10.11.15 - 20:57
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  • Moderator
    Kronos
    Posts: 1985 from 2003/2/24
    @red

    Yep right now the money invested in the X5000 development is a truckload of dead capital with 0 returns.

    Now think a few steps further and you might get an idea whom and how I expect to get eggfaced.
    --------------------- May the 4th be with you ------------------
    Mother Russia dance of the Zar, don't you know how lucky you are
  • »10.11.15 - 21:03
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    redrumloa
    Posts: 1420 from 2003/4/13
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:

    Now think a few steps further and you might get an idea whom and how I expect to get eggfaced.


    If I get your point, it would be a lot worse than eggfaced. It would certainly be curtains.
  • »10.11.15 - 21:14
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1724 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    I would love a tiny computer. Like the Efika, or RaPi. Then it doesn't need to be too powerful if it doesn't look too powerful :-) A single core 1.8 Ghz G4 with Altivec would do the trick (if available). As for the G5, it's very power hungry and gets hot as hell. Not really a good processor to begin with (except for raw CPU power).
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
    AMIGA FORUM - Sweden's Amiga Magazine!

    My MorphOS blog
  • »10.11.15 - 21:18
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1078 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    Kronos wrote:
    @red

    Yep right now the money invested in the X5000 development is a truckload of dead capital with 0 returns.

    Now think a few steps further and you might get an idea whom and how I expect to get eggfaced.


    AmigaOne branded X5000 will launch with MorphOS and not OS4 eh? ;)
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.9

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, OSX 10.5.8, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »10.11.15 - 21:24
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11055 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > You'll end up with something somewhere between the SAM460 and X5000.

    1.8 GHz e6500 (with AltiVec) vs. 2.2 GHz e5500 (without AltiVec) is an interesting comparison.

    > 1 or 2GB soldered

    I think 2 GiB is the reasonable minimum. 4 GiB would be nice (also for Linux use).
  • »10.11.15 - 21:39
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11055 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > no point in having multicore CPUs if the OS doesn't support it

    As the development of this board is supposed to be financed by a bounty, attracting a handful of Linux PPC enthusiasts by using a multicore CPU wouldn't hurt. Moreover, you may have problems finding a suitable single-core PPC SoC. And if you do, you'd save a single-digit dollar figure by not using the dual-core variant.
  • »10.11.15 - 21:44
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