Quote:

Doesn't matter whether they licensed it, sold it, rented it, prostituted it or wrapped it around their penis and conceived children with it. It wasn't theirs. Please stick to the point.

Quote:

And?


[ Edited by KennyR 19.03.2019 - 20:37 ]

> Doesn't matter whether they licensed it, sold it, rented it, prostituted it or wrapped it [...]

I'm with number6 here.

> Please stick to the point.

Please at least *try* to stick to the truth, even if it's hard sometimes.

>>> iComp are practically the only company still in speaking terms with Hyperion.

>> Even if true, the Manomio incident happened as long as 8 years ago.

> And?

What is the case now wasn't necessarily the case back then, obviously.

Quote:

If I can give you a tip, it's not to fussily nitpick everything people say, and just go with the actual point. You're infamous for it, when you do it a lot nobody reads it, and it often drives the conversation completely off track for no good reason.

Your sole contribution to this conversation was pointing out who IComp got the Commodore licence from. Thanks for that, but everything else you wrote was useless verbiage. Someone had actually predicted it on IRC when I wrote "bought" (of which I still give zero shits about the distinction, tbh), and said I should change it before you got wind - but I said, nah, not even Andreas could be that uselessly pedantic. Thanks for disappointing me.

[ Edited by KennyR 19.03.2019 - 21:08 ]

> If I can give you a tip [...]

Please spare me the patronizing.

> when you do it a lot nobody reads it

Then just don't, easy :-)

> Your sole contribution to this conversation was pointing out who IComp got the
> Commodore licence from. [...] everything else you wrote was useless verbiage.

I also pointed out that I don't deem it more likely that it was iComp who put Manomio in contact with Hyperion than that it was anybody else or nobody in particular at all, as today's perceived isolation of Hyperion wasn't there 8 years ago (or was it even more like 9 years ago?).

> Someone had actually predicted it on IRC when I wrote "bought" [...],
> and said I should change it

You should listen to those who know better :-)

> Thanks for disappointing me.

You're welcome. Seems I'm not that predictable ;-)

Quote:

Slow day and just trying to clarify some history here.
As you know from my prior details posted about Manomio and IAmiga, this was about Amiga perceived rights.

In reviewing this thread, however, I keep seeing the references to the Commodore kernel as being central to the dispute.

Do you have any information/link to support this?

I've seen such an allegation on another site, but also with no source. Upon contact, this poster also had no recollection of where this information might have come from.

I'm only talking about the Hyperion connection obviously. Manomio's issues with the app store and anything about their demise is a different topic..

If you know anything about this, I'd appreciate being filled in for sake of history. Thanks.

#6

> In reviewing this thread, however, I keep seeing the references
> to the Commodore kernel as being central to the dispute. Do you
> have any information/link to support this?

No, I do not have any information/link to support "the Commodore kernel [...] being central to the dispute", or anything else "being central to the dispute" for that matter.

Update:

> Yesterday's addendum to iComp's December press release: [...]
> This is a remarkably idiotic reasoning in my opinion and
> I'd be really baffled should he be successful with it.
> More from him [...]

"[...] we are not on exhibiting at the Amiga 34 event in Neuss, although iComp GmbH was among the initiators of the original Amiga 30 event, and we were even listed as a sponsor earlier this year. [...] Cloanto is co-sponsoring the Amiga 34, but at the same is pursuing legal steps against Hyperion [...]. [...] Cloanto was asked to to provide proof for the claims of owning certain rights, but did not do so until today. We see a strong similarity to their previous claim of owning an unlimited license to P96 for inclusion with an emulator product. [...] So why are we not starting legal action against Cloanto? Among legal professionals, there is the term of the "Italian Torpedo": If a party manages to take such a case to an Italian court, a timely judgement cannot be expected. Spending money on a lengthy lawsuit in Italy would be a very ineffective use of our money. [...] we have decided not to exhibit, because it would be against our policies to be a co-sponsor with Cloanto."
https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/33/items/icomp-does-not-exhibit-at-amiga-34.html

@ Andreas_Wolf

IMHO Jens is more and more starting to sound like Hitler in his bunker towards the final hours when Soviets closed in, ordering deployment of fantasy forces that didn't even exist, etc. I don't think Jens is making a very coherent impression anymore? Maybe he shouldn't be this public about his issues?

Well, it seems he won't pursue his "exclusive ownership" of P96. Not totally unexpected, I'd say. If he hadn't been so public about it before, maybe it would have been easier to swallow for him now instead of this bitter medicine? Crawling to the cross, but putting up an appearance that it's him calling the shots...

Quote:

Apparently now everyone attending Amiga 34 will also have to be wardrobe conscious. (evil grin)

#6

> it seems he won't pursue his "exclusive ownership" of P96.

"There's also good news from Cloanto: During a dinner that was organized by the organizer of the Amiga34 show, Michael Battilana said among witnesses that the advertising of his emulator product can be changed in order to represent the actual facts: The P96 archive that is delivered by Cloanto on DVDs and in downloads has shareware status. Purchasing the emulator does not register the copy of P96 for the customer. [...] We are expecting Cloanto to deliver on these words by changing web sites and advertising of their resellers in the near future."
https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/33/items/p96-v2-4-3-published.html

See also the changes in iComp wiki's P96 article:
http://wiki.icomp.de/w/index.php?title=P96&diff=7277&oldid=7210

Quote:

Dinner at the Amiga34 event? Is this the same dinner, or meeting behind closed doors that some other source claimed that Mike Battilana was not invited to, and so could not have been quoted for saying anything? I guess these must be two different events, the dinner where Mike B. was in attendance, and the "behind closed doors" meeting of several prominent people in the community, which was said to NOT have Mike B. in attendance.

Quote:
Maybe they did (also) eat something there? :) Both parties seem to be around the same table....

Damn I hope Cloanto stops this bullshit, they are not doing anything for the Amiga scene and we need Jens great work !!

What BS??

Undisputed:
- Cloanto does have a licence to distribute AmigaOS files with AmigaForever (dating back to GateWay times)
- Cloanto does have a licence to distribute P96 files with AmigaForever

Disputed
- Cloanto legally owns "Amiga" after buying it in McBill's garage sale
- Cloanto has the right to distribute AmigaOS outside of AmigaForever
- The P96 distributed with AmigaForever is a full version not requiring the user to pay the shareware fee


Proven to be BS:
- Cloanto is distributing P96 illegally
- Cloanto has no right to distribute AmigaOS


-> If Jens had put his brain into "on" mode he would never had started a dispute with Cloanto cos he doesn't have any beef in the only real dispute (who owns has rights to AmigaOS to what extent).

[ Edited by Kronos 21.10.2019 - 13:37 ]

> If Jens had put his brain into "on" mode he would never had started
> a dispute with Cloanto cos he doesn't have any beef in the only
> real dispute (who owns has rights to AmigaOS to what extent).

Yes, Jens' partisanship in the "real dispute" seems puzzling at first glance. Maybe the answer to that is something else (last paragraph) than a switched-off brain :-)

Quote:

And the Cloanto side of this story is? (evil grin)

I can not help but think back to the last time they tried this at Amiga 32. Trevor:
Quote:
source of quote


History repeats itself judging from the picture posted.


@amigadave

Indeed different events.
Amitopia pic with description
Easily compared with the pic that @JPV posted above in post #37.

#6

> And the Cloanto side of this story is? (evil grin)

http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&u=https://www.a1k.org/forum/index.php?threads/68694/page-15%23post-1326799
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUD7y5mpTao (25:43 - 29:18)

"With regard to P96 he explained that in his conversation with Jens Schönfeld a settlement has not been reached but he is glad that they talked and at least could clarify some details. Furthermore he pointed out that he himself would have never spoken about lawsuits. Instead, he would prefer to solve problems quietly. "
http://www.amiga-news.de/en/news/AN-2019-11-00002-EN.html


Edit: added Youtube link
Edit2: added summary

[ Edited by Andreas_Wolf 05.11.2019 - 09:01 ]

Update:

> https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/33/items/p96-v2-4-3-published.html

"Cloanto does false advertising for their emulation product, despite a personal promise of the business owner. Buying a Cloanto product never includes a P96 license. If you believed to also purchase a P96 license with the purchase of a Cloanto product, we believe that you can return it for a refund due to a severe legal shortcoming of the product."
https://icomp.de/shop-icomp/en/33/items/p96-v2-4-4-published.html

"If you believed to also purchase a P96 license with the purchase of a Cloanto product"

I think there is a semantic issue there. Cloanto is obviously not in the business of selling P96 licenses, they however do sell a product that includes a fully licensed P96 since forever.

This thread is also not MorphOS specific, except that MorphOS can run on Amigas equipped with a PPC card that COULD also have icomp hardware installed.
icomp doesn't sell PPC cards, do they?

> This thread is also not MorphOS specific

Will surely be moved in an instant :-) (And so will every updated off-topic thread not yet moved.)

Quote:

What a hot mess.

@ Andreas_Wolf

Quote:

Rather disappointing that you did not point out Individual Computers has sold hardware that was compatible with MorphOS...

Quote:

It is such a shame this is now happening. MorphOS has a lineage dating back to the Commodore Amiga. This is the only "Amiga" related forum I frequent, and now such discussion is being suppressed. This forum is going to become a ghost town if only strictly discussing MorphOS laser-focused and nothing else. I guess there will be spotty spikes every ~3 years when a new MorphOS release drops, but then will quickly drop to no traffic shortly thereafter.



[ Edited by redrumloa 14.01.2020 - 11:16 ]

> Individual Computers has sold hardware that was compatible with MorphOS...

True, but I didn't anticipate that a long discontinued MorphOS-compatible add-in card gives sufficient MorphOS-relevance to a thread about the vendor's present (i.e. 1...1½ decades later) and future activities and statements, which in no way have any bearing on MorphOS.
General discussions of Apple Inc. incoming in 3, 2, 1... ;-)