You're right about that. Unfortunatly it makes you wonder who actually is going to write usefull software anytime soon.

> Flash is [...] propietary and MOS-Team shouldn't waste a minute of their time
> reverse engineering it. You have sucky projects like Gnash that take care of that

I think by wishing for a port of Flash he didn't mean the MorphOS Team to reverse engineer the original Adobe Flash but instead "just" port already reverse engineered projects like Gnash and Lightspark, in a way Fab did already with old Swfdec. If he really meant what you think he did though I'd second your objection that this would be an outright silly waste of resources.

Quote:

Well, Gnash has evolved rather slowly, and it also had to catch up with swfdec in the first place. As it is now, Gnash support is still not very convincing (as i said, some things will run in Gnash and not in swfdec, and vice versa).

As for lightspark, it's much more promising, but it also relies on recent OpenGL features like shaders, buffer and so on to work (which explains why it's faster, along with its JIT). I actually had a look at lightspark sources, and besides this blocking GL issue, it would look quite portable. But imo, it's not worth porting until lightspark supports older flash correctly as well, because the fallback to gnash thing is quite messy.

> lightspark [...] relies on recent OpenGL features like shaders, buffer and so
> on to work [...]. I actually had a look at lightspark sources, and besides this
> blocking GL issue, it would look quite portable. But imo, it's not worth porting
> until lightspark supports older flash correctly as well, because the fallback to
> gnash thing is quite messy.

Thanks for explanation.

Yes, this thread has been most educational.

For example, I wasn't aware of the fact that while 32-bit Flash was included in most Linux distros it could be replaced by 64-bit Flash by the users (until Andreas posted his links). And until Fab explained why Flash support hadn't been updated, I was not aware that incorporating newer code (like lightspark) would be so problematic.

That only leaves improved OpenGL support and a word processor (on my wish list)

One quick question.
Will MOS2.8 be able to boot from SCSI or SATA controllers or will these drive only work after booting from PATA?

[ Edited by Jim 08.08.2011 - 18:51 ]

I also want to like to know more about SATA support. I understood well, MorhpOS on Powermac wouldn't even work with one of these cards installed ? Or can I already use such a card now with MacOSX on it ?

Reason I ask is that I want to learn more about MacOSX before I buy an Intel one and replace my now 6 years old windowsXP box that doesn't want to run windows7 because a certain nvidia chipset isn't supported ( it already wasn't in Vista ). So it would be fine I can put Leopard on a SATA drive without touching the drives I use for MorphOS.

Oepabakkes,
Quote:

probably the SCSI/SATA adapters here http://morphos.de/hardware.html will be usable in PowerMac G4 in MorphOS2.8 (atm these adapters are usable in Pegasos)
I use atm a SATA card iSiI3x1x (but I have some problems) and a SCSI card Symbios 89x (sometimes also problems) in Pegasos2.

Quote:

In the PowerMac FW800 G4 I use atm a very good Adaptec card ; here as seen in pciscan in MorphOS2.7:
Vendor 0x9005 <Adaptec> Device 0x10 <AHA-2940U2B SCSI Controller>
This very good card is perfect in OSX Leopard 10.5.8 and OSX Tiger 10.4.x (not supported in MorphOS2.x)

Quote:

In a PowerMac MDD and FW800 there is an ATA100 (also an ATA66 and ATA33), well I use a very good HD WD 500gb PATA and I have 60Mb/s throughput :) ;) ,so no useful to use (my opinion) a SATA bootstrap HD ; I also use the very good YABOOT for MorphOS2.x, Leopard OSX, Tiger OSX, Panther OSX and Linux Debian ... all in these OS in one HD 500gb :)
here a guide about YABOOT if interested http://www.nonsoloamiga.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=106

In a PowerMac AGP graphics, gigabit ethernet, quicksilver 2001/2002 It could be useful to use an HD SATA via SATA adapter (ATA inside is only ATA66), this is my opinion.
Sonnet has/had good SATA controller for PowerMac, Tempo SATA controller models ( look at here for exemple http://www.sonnettech.com/support/kb/kb.php?cat=284#position_content ) usable in OSX


[ Edited by Divinity 08.08.2011 - 22:13 ]

Jim,
Quote:

not useful SCSI HD bootable ... but yes you can bootstrap from HD SCSI and SATA, but the kernel need to be in a "bootable"/viewable unit for the OpenFirmware (in Macintosh) and for SmartFirmware (in PegasosI/II and Efika)
For exemple you can have an hd PATA in a Mac (with inside the MorphOS kernel boot.img, bootinfo.txt) and a bootable SFS partition in a HD SCSI or SATA (if SCSI and SATA host adapters supported in MorphOS2.x)


[ Edited by Divinity 08.08.2011 - 21:41 ]

Just a sidenote:
Macs CAN boot from PCI-devices (if these have an OF-BIOS onboard). My 2x1.8 QS came with an 400GB IDE HD connected too an ATA133+2SATA PCI card and it booted OSX just damn fine.

[ Edited by Kronos 09.08.2011 - 00:22 ]

Thanks Kronos. That's an interesting option.
What controller are you using?

The onboard one as the combo-card is not supported by MorphOS (and probraly will never be).

O.k. I could have put the boot.img and maybe an ISO-file of the MorphOS-CD to claim some level of booting from SATA ...

AFAIK there is only one out of the box Mac and MorphOS (2.8) compatible outthere (made by Sonnet and hard to find).

Cheap PC cards with the right chip should work (once you found a way to load boot.img from another device) and some of those might even be reflashed to work directly.

Just wait for 2.8 and see what the otions are...

To be precise, it's this one:

http://www.sonnettech.com/product/tempo_serial_ata.html

It's a two-port card with a Sil3112 controller...

Mine is waiting for its use in my Powermac G4...

Why that complicated?

I never booted from hd with my powermac from the beginning.
I am using a dedicated usb key with the boot.img on it. The leaves
open which i boot next, if supported or not :)

What hard to find card ? Sonnet still sells it and I found 4 on Ebay ... but they between 80 Dollar and 80 Euro without shipping. Well if it that is what it takes to run Leopard without touching the MorphOS hd's on the internal port and I guess it keeps a certain value.

@Oepabakkes

Well, "hard to find" is often connected to the price you are able or willing to pay... I think in this case Kronos meant a SATA card for a reasonable price, or as a complete Powermac G4 package (e.g. with CPU-card, advanced Radeon card etc.).

Understandable, but when was Amiga computing ever cheap if you talk about new hardware ? Even old vintage hardware is sometimes worth VERY good money.

About this card: Sonnet is quality and the price at Sonnet's shop is reasonable for people in the USA -I think- and in Euro's +/- 57 Euro. But at the German Ebay it's horrible 80 euro + shipping 20 euro. Ouch.

Quote:

Like... in1985? When you could get a A1000 with monitor for 1595$ while Apple Macintosh costed 2,5 grand, and the IBM PC Junior (64 KB of RAM, one 5,25 floppy and no monitor) costed 1300$ ?

1595$ wasn't exactly cheap 26 years ago. A C64, that was cheap in 1985.

Will there be a native MorphOS Professional File System for 2.8?

Considering this two posts, I think meaby..

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=7805&post_id=83059&viewmode=flat&sortorder=0&showonepost=1

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=3&topic_id=7805&post_id=83090&viewmode=flat&sortorder=0&showonepost=1

Omg, am I Andreas now? ;)

[ Edited by pampers 10.08.2011 - 22:57 ]

> Omg, am I Andreas now? ;)

Don't worry, you're just using the Web in the way it was meant to be used. There's nothing bad about that, as opposed to what some people might tell you ;-)
(You should change the sortorder to "1" in your second link as an ugly workaround for the MZ bugs.)

@pampers

"Omg, am I Andreas now? ;)"

No, because you aren't quoting your own posts.

And more importanly he is not doing it 3 levels deep......

Andreas_Wolf,


The way you post links to a post that contains links, whcih then contains links to the releavant post is not in any way shape or form a good way of using forums. If you have found the info just bloody post it.

+1