Anyone else check this out?

http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=54237

Sounds like McEwen's trying to make a few bucks while diluting the value of the settlement with Hyperion.

He is foolish conmen who thought he found a bigger fool, but then he was outconned and reacted by finding an even bigger fool ......

I consider the news 100% pleasant, the cons going for another round and we won't run out of popcorn-material anytime soon.

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I completely agree with Kronos on this one, this is 100% pleasant.

And the pure entertainment value of looking at the confusion, shock and horror this caused among some of the Blind Amiga Trademark Followers over at Amigaworld.net is priceless!

Someone, please bring more popcorn!

Well, if this isn't successfully challenged, the last tiny bit of credibility associated with the Amiga name goes out the window.

As a MorphOS supporter, I should be less concerned with this, but it's hard not to be offended. What Hyperion and A-eon have been working on required a real investment in time and money. This "Amiga" grabs its OS from the hard work of others in our community (for free of all things).

So how much would it cost to support an X1000 port of MorphOS? I'd hate to see that project disappear thanks to the maneuvers of a dick not named Terrence.

get's better...

http://www.osnews.com/story/23756/Commodore_USA_Threatens_OSNews_with_Legal_Action

@ Jim

Why support hardware for about 1800Euros? Who wants to buy such a thing? A MorphoS port for 20 units (my own sarcastic estimation of selling numbers )does not make sense.
Hasn?t it been stated by Laire himself, that small numbered systems will not be supported in the future?

Well, strange stuff with C=. Doomed to fail. Why buy a PC in homecomputer casing to run an open source OS?
To me the tough and hysterical reaction by C= on the article of OS News shows something like doubts and incertainties of C= with their own project.

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How could it? Amiga Inc is free to do whatever they want with their own IP.

Here is my take on it (somewhat ripped out of a context):

http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost.php?p=577157&postcount=61

http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost.php?p=577162&postcount=65

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Didn't that go away when Amiga Inc proclaimed "Amiga is dead, long live Amiga" already?

From that it was just down hill IMO, and the more legal clercs that got involved in the mess, the further down it went...

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Personally, I'm not the slightest offended by this. Rather the opposite, I think it's kind of cool that someone with a chance of creating a product that some people might actually want and can afford, will be able to sell it under a Commodore Amiga brand. Will be fun to see what (if anything) actually comes out of this.

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They have never owned the Amiga trademark, even though they may have fooled people into believing so. If they have made some business plan based on false assumptions, it's their mistake, and their problem.

Could it perhaps be that they have spent that investment in time and money on something that nobody *really wants* after all? When you look at what is really underneath the brand sticker, when you look at the actual product?

And why the "pity game" about Hyperion? Hyperion's history (and the people associated with it) is quite dark and dirty, they are everything but the innocent little lambs that some people wants to make them. On top of that, the way they obtained the "settlement" that granted them the rights to use some specific trade marks, was quite ugly IMHO (not that I care the slightest about Amiga Inc, but anyway). And now, together with A-EON they are trying to pull off a profiteering scheme, by abusing and destroying the trade mark even further.

The *beta class hardware* they are about to sell to consumers (who won't be treated as consumers (LINK)) will cost 1150 UKP ~ 1780 USD ~ 1400 EUR (LINK). Plus shipment, Plus VAT, Plus everything you need to make a computer out of this mainboard with memory.

It's an absolutely insane price. It's outright ridiculous. And the only reason some people would even consider paying that kind of money, is because it is some "sacred Amiga branded stuff". It's certainly *not* for the qualities and performance of the hardware; it's 2007 level performance stuff with bog standard PC controllers anyway. It smells profiteering a long way.

But not only that, they shamelessly plans to do one of the pre-payment schemes, where they will raise at least a hefty 75,000 EUR from these consumers (who won't be treated as consumers) before anyone has even seen the thing, presumably as a way to shift the financial risk of upfront payment for producing the first batch from themselves to the consumers.

Only "AmigaOne TM" makes this possible. Blind Amiga Followers forms a line to hand over their cash to these people. Not because the people behind it are good (because they aren't), not because the hardware is good, or anything like that, but because it's "AmigaOne TM".

Look at MorphOS for a change. It is doing just fine. Without the Amiga name. It's doing fine by aiming for Amiga excellence. People use it for this reason, not for some "bogus" trade mark that Ben Hermans has forced from Amiga Inc.

Had some people only stopped for a minute to think about "What is Amiga, what is it to me? What is 'the real' when it comes to 'NG', is it the best Amiga compatibility, the best performance, the best features? Or is it all about a trade mark that Ben Hermans managed to squeeze out from the Amiga Inc?"

This will be a very healthy eye-opener for many people! "What is Amiga?", "What is 'the real'?"

Maybe people will start looking at *the actual products* instead of a slapped on trade mark sticker as a result? If so, it won't be a bad thing at all...

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This "Amiga" will be *exactly* as much Amiga as A-EON's "AmigaONE", it will be *exactly ZERO difference*! They are dubbed "Amiga" in exactly the same way; through a license from Amiga Inc, so they can slap an Amiga sticker on it. Only difference is, that this one will also have a Commodore sticker on it. And since the stickers is the only, single reason to why some people buys some stuff, the only question is whether you consider *two* stickers to be better than just one! Surely a Commodore + Amiga sticker will be better than just one Amiga sticker?

And Guess what, AROS is free, open source, so it's completely free for anyone to use it. Actually, I think the AROS people would be kind of glad if they did!

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Perhaps you have missed the publicly know fact that a MorphOS port for "X1000" will *never* happen, thanks to the maneuvers of a dick not named Herr Mans...

Ohh! Barry Altman's a touchy cuss! I fired off a negative e-mail to him and got a really nasty response. If any of you are interested, I'll post it.

Yeah, do it
If anyone is convinced with his project, he should schow some souvereignity and not be touchy. Should give us some insights in the credibility of this company...

OK, here goes, received today:

Iggybeans,

Who are you, what rock did you crawl out from under, who appointed you king of technocratia, and what is your real name? I know you love those avatars, but since you know who I am, I would like to address you by a name. If you want a discussion, I will be more than happy to answer EVERY single question you may have. IN DETAIL. The ignoramuses that are espousing all these hilarious fabrications and conjectures are not only way off base, but sometimes actually approach borderline slander and libel.

Since you have such strong convictions, and actually took the time to write your email, are you strong enough to confront me directly, or are you only able to maintain your position without a responsive recipient on the other end of your diatribes. Let's see.

If you actually had the balls to call me, I would give it a 95% chance that you would change your position 180 degrees regarding Commodore. There is so much to tell, yet reading those forum posts do give up quite a laugh. Knowledge is golden?want some gold?

Although I don't expect your reply, I will be more than willing to continue your inquisition anytime. You'll be in for quite a shock when you realize what is really going on behind the scenes, and in hindsight, even you will see how ridiculous most of those posted comments really are.

Barry


Barry S. Altman/ CEO
Commodore USA, LLC

This is the first of two messages. For some reason both mention my balls. He seems really concerned with my testicles. Tonight I plan on standing on my lawn and waving them toward the South while I piss in his general direction.

Edit - Make that three messages and counting.

[ Edited by Jim on 2010/9/2 2:52 ]

Quickly, before I go back to tweaking Barry Altman's nose, the IP in question may not even be Bill McEwen's to reassign. That question has never faced a legal challenge as there was no one else left to challenge it. There is plenty of evidence that indicates that Amiga Inc. owns NOTHING.

[ Edited by Jim on 2010/9/2 3:02 ]

Wow!
What a decent mail from Barry...
Friendly words and lots of "facts" ....
Good base for a reasonable discussion, indeed...hehehe...
Well, also seems to me that C= has nothing much to offer or has even been cheated by Bill the Evil.
Realizing that and realizing that the scene is not to bee cheated so easily, Barry gets frustrated and slightly irritated, so his ball-mail proves.
If there was something straight behind the project he wouldn?t even have reacted.
Well, barking dogs don?t bite...(or in this case can?t bite)...

@Jim

Wow.. your balls must be amazing. Care to share pictures of them? :)

Finally we have some popcorn-entertainment.. it's been a looong loong time without heh

Well, while the response was kind of pathetic the question is why did you bother to mail him in 1st place? Who cares about "Commodore" or "Amiga"? Amiga went under somewhen in the 90ies.

I would suggest that we all leave the ranting and raving about Commodore USA & Amiga Inc. over on the other websites that care more about what name is printed on the front of their computer than they care about how well it runs the programs they want/need to use.

It is entertaining to read some of the histrionics that are being displayed on other sites, but we don't really need them here too. I would like to think that we are past the point of caring what Amiga Inc. does, or does not do, as IMHO they have always been irrelevant in regards to the existing Amiga community.

Thanks, you all have valid points and I'll step back from this after I talk with Barry later today (and don't worry, I'm not likely to be drawn to the "dark side").

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Very well put Sir, I 100% agree!

Over and out!

takemehomegrandma wrote:

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Do you really believe they are tring to make a crapload of money off of the X1000? I can think of a million better ways to make money. If I wanted to really PROFIT I would certainly not choose the Amiga market as my number one choice.

Trevor (head of A-EON) is an Amiga user and owns pretty much every machine under the sun, including MorphOS machines, and has a clear love for the Amiga, going way back to the Amiga 1000.

I think the motivation is not really about money but trying to advance the Amiga platform.

And yes, it's an insane price. When you produce in low volumes a high-spec PPC board like this, of course it's going to be expensive. Producing ANY product in low volumes has a higher per unit price. When you start to mass-produce you see the savings.

This has been the case on every piece of "new" amiga hardware since Commodore died. I find it crazy that people still don't get that. Low volume = high price.

By the way, this high price (including Pegasos-2 which cost me over $1000 - same price as my MicroA1) was one of the reasons why the MorphOS team has moved to cheap second hand PPC macs.

Well new Amiga hardware may be a moot point as it appears that Altman's serious. So whether they like it or not, those who cling to the Amiga name are likely to get X86 boxes in their future.

As Zylesea has stated, why bother with it? It's not an issue for our community and if Altman can make some money out of it he's doing better than McEwen.

Jim'my let me ask: how is ur balls? :D

Apparently the balls can take some abuse. Its a new fact of life (at least in the US) that when you question someone they go on the offensive.

So for jumping into something that doesn't really concern me, my sack gets used as a punching bag. No big deal.

Jim, that e-mail from Altman was an amusing read. At least, it showed the man has an unprecedent amount of energy to spend on... well... nothing. It really looks as if writing that e-mail was the last thing he did, just before his head exploded like a supernova.
But he is right in one detail: Why did you hide behind an alias, not showing your real identity? At least you are "Jim" over here. Talking about your identity here, I think your avatar holds a flamethrower? Could it be that you used it in your first e-mail to Altman?

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Yes but, like you say, Trevor IS a very long time Amiga fan. And thus, he SHOULD have devised a realistic plan, not this ye again, once more, "superpower computer" scheme that noone believes, not is able to buy.

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Then, grab some money from credible investors, go to bPlan, have them desing a REALISTIC computer for you, and insist in making them solder down one of those rare Transputer things, to have that "unique" spec no one else has.

As for the operating system, why not MorphOS? That team really does have a good track record. The Pegasos DID EXIST and was SOLD, and was born with MorphOS. After that, the Efika came. It's true it took a very long time to port MorphOS, but I think there were also hardware problems that delayed it (see that "B" letter in the CPU name).

Heck, it was done ten years ago! It was called Thendic, now Genesi (hunting more boring opportunities now).

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Of course, we all know that! What chokes on people is not that low volume means a high price, is the fact of picking this disadvantage as the starting point for a new market. It's insane. Computers are expected to be almost free today. The same goes for software. Check the amount of things you can do with a five hundred dollar regular computer today. There's no way you can compete with that, ever. Instead, they pick an elitist scheme that looks, smells and walks like a profiteering strategy.

@Jim

If you are going to post a private email, you should at least post what you sent him first so we can all see what he responded to. I'm not saying he should have replied the way he did, I'm just saying that context is everything.

By your own admission, you have a fixed view, so why did you bother to email him ? Were you trolling him ?

His company can't be making much money if he is wasting time replying to someone he believes will never be a customer.

I think it's all crap... on the other hand: Weren't we all silently hoping for some events like this ? Otherwise it's way to boring on Amigaworld.net and the likes.

Back to get out the popcorn.
Yes, I freely admit that my message to him was pretty unpleasant. I make no excuses for my intense dislike of one of his business associates, Bill McEwen (at Amiga Inc.).
And I don't think it had sunken in yet that this development didn't really matter to me. I use Windows, OSX, Linux, and MorphOS, but nothing I use carries an Amiga moniker.
I'm not one of the foolish people that think there's going to be some resurrection from the dead for the Amiga platform. Heck, Amigans can't even agree on what that would be.
Should it be a continuation of the original chipset (a la Natami), a PPC based system (under AOS4 or MorphOS), or a new system using industry standard X86 components?

These issues don't really phase me. I'm using MorphOS, not as much for its Amiga roots, as for the fact that I like the OS on its own merits.

Hell, I'm convinced we have a lot of really intelligent head cases in the Amiga community (some of them I'd even consider friends). But it does make for good theater, doesn't it?