DeluxePaint Source Code Released
  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1074 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    Jupp3 wrote:
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    There's nothing stopping anyone distributing a diff of any changes they make to the code I guess.


    Well, the license does specifically mention "Derivative Works", and I assume a diff could be interpreted to be exactly that...


    I'm no lawyer but AFAIK a Derivative Work contains parts of the original work, which doesn't apply to a diff as it contains only new content.

    Then there's the whole EULA gray area due to such things not bring legally binding in certain countries too.

    The source to PPaint or Brilliance etc would be much preferable in my humble opinion though. Sadly we'll never see it for the former though. :/
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.9

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, OSX 10.5.8, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »03.08.15 - 22:50
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  • Order of the Butterfly
    Order of the Butterfly
    Raf_MegaByte
    Posts: 430 from 2004/10/10
    From: Nella grande r...
    There is nothing pointless or unuseful.

    Dpaint was one of those paint program capable of drawing smooth lines and curves just by manipulating a mouse (and Amiga mouse was poor in DPI) with very few jaggies and minimal pixelation steps when moving mouse...

    Sure must admit that part of credits of that splendid behaviour and superb DPaint draw experiences went to Amiga Hardware graphic chip and graphics subroutines but sure it was very friendly (amichevole) and truly satisfying to create a draw picture with DPaint.

    There are few modern programs capable to perform such capability: ProjectDogwaffle (PD Pro) paint, Paint Tool SAI japanese paint program and obviously Amiga TV Paint.

    Programmers and coders who want to realize a good paint program should be obliged study DeLuxe Paint source code...

    DPaint must be considered and respected as "The Bible" of all paint software ever!

    [ Edited by Raf_MegaByte 04.08.2015 - 10:37 ]
    Bill Gates "Think!", Steve Jobs: "Think different!" So... Let these guy continue blabbering thinking and enjoy computing! We are on Amiga!
  • »04.08.15 - 10:24
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  • MorphOS Developer
    CISC
    Posts: 617 from 2005/8/27
    From: the land with ...
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    I'm no lawyer but AFAIK a Derivative Work contains parts of the original work, which doesn't apply to a diff as it contains only new content.


    Unfortunately that is incorrect, due to the nature of how diff works there will be lots of fragments of the original work in a diff, however one could argue that the intention of this clause was not to disallow diffs, but rather disallowing complete works with derivative code.


    - CISC
  • »04.08.15 - 11:13
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Intuition
    Posts: 1074 from 2013/5/24
    From: Nederland
    Quote:

    CISC wrote:
    Quote:

    Intuition wrote:
    I'm no lawyer but AFAIK a Derivative Work contains parts of the original work, which doesn't apply to a diff as it contains only new content.


    Unfortunately that is incorrect, due to the nature of how diff works there will be lots of fragments of the original work in a diff, however one could argue that the intention of this clause was not to disallow diffs, but rather disallowing complete works with derivative code.


    - CISC


    I see, thanks for the info. :)
    1.67GHz 15" PowerBook G4, 1GB RAM, 128MB Radeon 9700M Pro, 64GB SSD, MorphOS 3.9

    2.7GHz DP G5, 4GB RAM, 512MB Radeon X1950 Pro, OSX 10.5.8, 500GB SSHD, MorphOS 3.9
  • »04.08.15 - 11:49
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  • Acolyte of the Butterfly
    Acolyte of the Butterfly
    deka
    Posts: 131 from 2013/2/12
    From: Hungary, Kecsk...
    Diff is only one way for patching...
    I think, If this is really vital to port to MOS, then it will be ported and will be found the way, how to do it legally.

    But, I am also not a lawyer...

    [ Edited by deka 04.08.2015 - 12:05 ]
  • »04.08.15 - 12:04
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    amigadave
    Posts: 2715 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Arrowhead...
    Quote:

    XzIt wrote:

    there is no 6, 5 was the last version made for Amiga.

    Ms-Dos versions: Deluxe Paint II, Deluxe Paint II Enhanced, Deluxe Paint II Enhanced 2.0.
    even had a Atari ST version "Deluxe Paint ST" plus Mac version Deluxe Paint II.

    X


    Although I never saw or owned any of the PC, Atari, or Mac versions of DPaint, I was not doubting that they had been distributed, I just doubted that they had the exact same features and functions that the original Amiga version had.

    If the other versions were just as good (or better), I suspect that I would have heard about them before, but maybe I am wrong, and the versions for other platforms were just as good at animating in particular, but I really doubt it.

    Perhaps any lack of performance in other versions of DPaint's animation routines (if they don't animate as well as the Amiga version as I suspect) are due to the Amiga's superior hardware and OS integration, and not because the code is any different between versions on other platforms. Maybe I will try to find a used copy of DPaint for the PC, or Mac to test it's animation capabilities for myself to see if my assumptions are correct.
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »04.08.15 - 15:15
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  • ASiegel
    Posts: 1229 from 2003/2/15
    From: Central Europe
    Quote:

    amigadave wrote:
    Although I never saw or owned any of the PC, Atari, or Mac versions of DPaint, I was not doubting that they had been distributed, I just doubted that they had the exact same features and functions that the original Amiga version had.

    There were certainly differences. The MS-DOS versions were officially called "Deluxe Paint II", for instance.

    Quote:

    If the other versions were just as good (or better), I suspect that I would have heard about them before, but maybe I am wrong, and the versions for other platforms were just as good at animating in particular, but I really doubt it.

    On MS-DOS, there was a spin-off product called "Deluxe Paint Animation".

    Generally, the MS-DOS version of Deluxe Paint was used in the creation of some popular products such as id Software┬┤s DOOM.
  • »04.08.15 - 16:14
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Jupp3
    Posts: 1192 from 2003/2/24
    From: Helsinki, Finland
    Quote:

    deka wrote:
    Diff is only one way for patching...
    I think, If this is really vital to port to MOS, then it will be ported and will be found the way, how to do it legally.


    It's not vital in any way. Firstly, it's outdated (the last version is 5, this one is 1), secondly, there are already better programs available, that run on MorphOS. Grafx2, Personal Paint (I think the latest 68k version works mostly?), and even the latest Deluxe Paint works at least partially.

    Of course, the only "native" one of those is Grafx2, Deluxe Paint hasn't been developed in over 2 decades, and Personal Paint is 68k/OS4-only, seemingly without any hope for native MorphOS version ever (a while back it could have been done, but not since being acquired by A-Eon, the deal is specifically worded so, that no-one else may do that, and they apparently don't want to do it themselves)

    But... Does "not being native" really matter at all for now? Such simple programs don't really need much CPU power at all, so as long as there's 68k emulation, that won't really matter.
  • »05.08.15 - 11:23
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11007 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    > Personal Paint is 68k/OS4-only, seemingly without any hope for native MorphOS version
    > ever (a while back it could have been done, but not since being acquired by A-Eon, [...]
    > they apparently don't want to do it themselves)

    180 buyers needed according to them.

    https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?forum=9&topic_id=4136&start=22
  • »05.08.15 - 13:48
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Jupp3
    Posts: 1192 from 2003/2/24
    From: Helsinki, Finland
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    180 buyers needed according to them.


    That's still only an "idea", that's not been put into action.

    Someone also offered to port it to MorphOS for free, which they rejected. Which one would you think to be the most profitable option for them? I guess this just clearly proves it's not about the money, it's just politics...
  • »05.08.15 - 14:22
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    Andreas_Wolf
    Posts: 11007 from 2003/5/22
    From: Germany
    >> 180 buyers needed according to them.

    > That's still only an "idea", that's not been put into action.

    You mean there are 180 MorphOS users who preordered, but A-Eon still declined?
  • »05.08.15 - 22:48
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  • Yokemate of Keyboards
    Yokemate of Keyboards
    amigadave
    Posts: 2715 from 2006/3/21
    From: Lake Arrowhead...
    Quote:

    Jupp3 wrote:
    Someone also offered to port it to MorphOS for free, which they rejected. Which one would you think to be the most profitable option for them? I guess this just clearly proves it's not about the money, it's just politics...



    Who offered? Can you provide a link to the source of this claim? I see Trevor and Matthew once a year usually, and would like to ask them why they would refuse an offer to port any software under their control to MorphOS for free.

    Edit: It makes no sense for them to inhibit any MorphOS software development, specially now that a port of MorphOS to the X5000 has been announced for the future, and it is likely that the MorphOS port may be completed before any AmigaOS4.x port is completed.

    Edit2: Of course if the person who made the offer demanded that they control their own code after it had been ported, I can see why Trevor and Matthew would decline. They aren't going to give away their rights to any software source code they have purchased with the intent of making a profit, or at the least recouping the price they paid for that source code and distribution rights. Having a free version for MorphOS while other platforms had to pay for their copy would not work for A-Eon.

    [ Edited by amigadave 05.08.2015 - 14:35 ]
    MorphOS - The best Next Gen Amiga choice.
  • »05.08.15 - 23:29
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  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    Yasu
    Posts: 1724 from 2012/3/22
    From: Stockholm, Sweden
    @amigadave

    It would make sense if he only wants to support AmigaOS 4, but claim he likes everything so he doesn't have to participate in the camp wars.

    I do really hope it's not the case, but their initial claim that they first need 180 MorphOS buyers to port it is disturbing. First, it should be a relatively simple matter to port it to MorphOS (since they did it to AmigaOS 4). And second, after saying this they didn't set up a poll or anything to check if 180 copies even could be sold. So it at least shows that they are not eager to port it.
    AMIGA FORUM - Hela Sveriges Amigatidning!
    AMIGA FORUM - Sweden's Amiga Magazine!

    My MorphOS blog
  • »05.08.15 - 23:59
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  • jPV
  • Paladin of the Pegasos
    Paladin of the Pegasos
    jPV
    Posts: 1664 from 2003/2/24
    From: po-RNO
    Quote:

    Andreas_Wolf wrote:
    >> 180 buyers needed according to them.

    > That's still only an "idea", that's not been put into action.

    You mean there are 180 MorphOS users who preordered, but A-Eon still declined?


    His point is that they haven't even arranged any preorder campaign to get those preorders in the first place. Or have I missed some news item or is there a web page where you can place your preorder?


    Quote:

    amigadave wrote:
    Quote:

    Jupp3 wrote:
    Someone also offered to port it to MorphOS for free, which they rejected. Which one would you think to be the most profitable option for them? I guess this just clearly proves it's not about the money, it's just politics...



    Who offered? Can you provide a link to the source of this claim? I see Trevor and Matthew once a year usually, and would like to ask them why they would refuse an offer to port any software under their control to MorphOS for free.



    At least Andy indicated here that it's he who will do all of the porting and it's out of the question that someone else would do the porting for free for them to sell.

    This also indicates that Andy doesn't have much experience of MorphOS and he could need some help with the porting still...

    He also doesn't have a MorphOS machine to test the 68k version for example, and I once asked if he'd need an own machine to test/develop, but at least at that time there didn't seem to be need for it and he could get machines elsewhere if needed.

    So... although MorphOS port (or even better support/fixes in 68k version) is possible in theory, it still feels quite unlikely when read between the lines...

    Edit: itix also offered to donate his Efika to Andy as seen here, but then AmigaKit rejected it in the next message. In any case I was also told that fixing certain incompatibilities with 68k version and MorphOS have to wait until he has the hardware and official MorphOS support is decided..

    [ Edited by jPV 06.08.2015 - 19:09 ]
  • »06.08.15 - 08:45
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