Italian programmer Mr. Andrea "AFXGroup" Palmat?, realized in just six months an alpha version of OWB (Origyn Web Browser) and keep it online as a Christmas gift for all Amiga community.

OWB is a modern browser with HTML 4.0 and CSS support and it is based on Webkit Engine, an Open Source HTML engine for mobile devices derived from Apple WebCore, which is itself derived from KHTML engine.
KHTML it is the engine of Apple Safari browser and KDE Konqueror browser.

OWB for AmigaOS 4.0 it is Open Source and free from any bounty, but sure we all amigans feel enough grate (and free) to send some little pennies as a return christmas gift to Andrea, for the beautiful surprise gift he gave to all our community.

OWB it is downloadable at AFXGroup site and on OS4Depot:

http://www.amigasoft.net

http://os4depot.net

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Now:

As OWB it is all Open Source, could we ever see it on MorphOS too?

OWB is a *SDL* browser, meaning there's almost zero work in porting it, but also zero interest in using it. SDL just doesn't fit with a browser application.

Of course it could be done on MorphOS too, but the question is, why would it take 6 months when it should take 1 week or so?

Hi Raffaele,

I now you are a "pure heart", so I don't see any "agenda" in your post, but there is something I want to reply about.

Please, stop, anywhere, all that remarking about "free" and "without bounties". That is childish and offensive. Because it is not up to you and anybody else to judge if someone wants his work to be rewarded or not. Working is a holy activity. Can't be judged in a so futile and arrogant way. Expecially when the comparition is done with something that is in a total different area, usually known as Amiga.


-- alfonso

Sorry Fab, but this is nonsense. Who cares if it's SDL if there IS a free browser for the platform that works? It runs even on an A1200 with bppc with quite good speed, while Sputnik is not fast even on a G3!
If it's so easy and quick to port a browser (within 1 week), why do amiga and morphos community has to wait YEARS! for a modern web browser?

Furthermore on the screenshots I can see, that OWB's rendering engine is as good (if not better) than Sputnik's. Why torturing ourselves with porting Nokia's webkit for 2-3years, if it's possible to port an engine giving the similar result within 1 week!!??

I think we should have ported this years ago! Now we would have a modern browser and many people would be happy and would use the OS instead of leaving!! Once it's ready and usable, we still have time to write/optimize a better, native browser...

@Fab

I disagree... what's the problem? OWB on OS4 just requires some kind of GUI to enter URLs, save webpages, add URLs to favourite lists... not much.

In its current state is much better than IBrowse/AWeb/Voyager. And yeah, I'm considering it crashes and I know it completely lacks a GUI.

Quote:
I haven't use OWB, but most SDL apps and games that i have tried in MOS are disappointly SLOW. I can't say that Sputnik is fast, but it is just about usable even on a Amiga 1200. Perhaps the SDL implementation in MOS is kind of slow? I really don't know.

[ Edited by AmigaMancer on 2007/12/26 21:49 ]

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I sometimes *REALLY* wonder what you smoke dude... :)

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This thing didn't exist at all years ago.

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Believing screenshots is a serious mistake... :) BTW, Nokia's engine is 95% the same as OWB. Both based on Webkit. And Nokias one is already ported too. In some ways, it's already *lightyears* more advanced, than OWB. Hints: go try to login a site with OWB, use SSL, have bookmarks, cookies, and what so on... Wake up Neo, this is the real world. :)

[ Edited by Chain-Q on 2007/12/26 20:50 ]

[ Edited by Chain-Q on 2007/12/26 20:51 ]

@AmigaMancer,

unless you run those SDL apps on a powerup amiga, the impact is not that big (but you can still blit 2 to 4 times as fast using a more "native" way, for 2D apps at least). On an amiga, where resources are more limited, you'd better optimize blit routines too, if the application itself is already quite demanding and thus get rid of SDL. And no, the SDL implementation in MOS is not that slow.

About OWB, the problem is just that SDL is not suitable for that kind of application, at least on a desktop OS (OWB was thought for terminals and using SDL was probably a good way to achieve portability). This application being SDL, it makes it harder to integrate it properly in the host system (you can't have multiple windows, you can't drag'n'drop from OS to OWB (not without a bad hack), you get an alien gadgets look, and much more...)

OWB is not made/designed to be an SDL app. What it is about is that it provides abstraction interfaces that allow much easier porting. There's a sample implementation and that is the one using SDL, but OWB is certainly not designed around SDL.

If I myself were to port a html engine like webkit or gecko or whatever I would never ever use native (MUI/Zune/Intuition/whatever) gadgets/toolkit for things like buttons, string gadgets, listboxes, forms which are inside the html view/part of it. I would make everything self contained based on bitmaps, etc. and handling whole gadgets/input myself.

Btw, you can browse OWB source code here:

http://www.sand-labs.org/svn/trunk/

The abstraction layer is in BAL/ directory.

@ Rafaele

Nice for the OS4 guys. But where is the relevance for MorphOS?
Hint: There's Sputnik available since a couple of months.

BTW, we don't have cmake to build it yet. 8)

I heard that is slow on Classic Amigas.

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I dont know is it really good idea. You get inconsistent GUI not only visually but also functionally.

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Pure heart it is better than pur?e heart...

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It is not me who pointed this fact... Just Andrea seems that he want to let it clear he worked tirelessly for nothing, he asked no hardware, neither he asked ready cash and he also realized a good browser, giving to the community an entire Open Source work.

I think that OS4 people was not happy for the fact that they raised a bounty for Marcik, they also gave him an AmigaONE machine, and they are still forced to wait for their Sputnik release...
Andrea realized this browser because he was tired to wait for a modern browser.
As being a valid programmer he is now keeping profict of his skills.

Quote:

Let smart-thinking people free to talk.

People talk just to take vent to their mouth...

They criticize the flaws and the lacks that affect OWB but they forgot that good Marcik when released publicly Sputnik for the first time he gifted us with a pre-release too, and in its first early stage Sputnik was more or less similar to OWB...


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With all the respect to the work of Marcik who did a Stupendous job releasing Sputnik...

But 2 (two) browsers are better than just simply 1 (one and only) browser...

The more the merrier...

The more browsers and then the platform it is more respected, and better considered from the public standing outside...

(and the outside public it is looking at any advancement of Amiga platform)

And I also hope that if the OWB project of Andrea Palmat? it is entirely Open Source for real, then it could be implemented OWB engine (Webkit core) into Aweb and IBrowse...

This time, I can say I do see some agenda in your post.

-- alfonso

@Raf,

i don't blame OWB for its unfinished state (missing GUI or crashes), but for the design itself. It's considerably easier to rely on SDL, but it's flawed for the reasons itix and i gave.

About the fact it's free, mmh... If like you say, you want nothing in return, you don't set up a paypal account in the first place for recompilation projects such as mplayer & co. Don't get me wrong, that's his choice and there's nothing wrong with that, but i wouldn't say it's a *free* project. It's more or less equivalent to a bounty cash-wise, in the end.

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Bounty, bounnty everywhere!

Once it was called Giftware...

You donate a gift in cash only if you like it...

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He's providing a service. You know, because there's some of us who doesn't code who enjoy the work of those who do, and also like contributing with with what they can.

Those times whose only bads were alowed to benifit from money should be long gone.

BTW by abiding itself to be Open Source it becomes *free*.

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dunno but i want some.

There is gugu in this irc channel atm who is repeating "this is not funny at all" "that thread could be funny and it is not funny at all" and he is right.

Come on peeps. That is not a browser. It is a game sold as a free browser with the help of some mates. Donate! We are the Salvation Army!

It seems like a university thesis about the power of suggestion and fanboysm. Teens College Rock and Roll Band.

It needs 20M of stack. Repeat with me "twenty mega bytes of stack" What is that? A Vista Mouse Driver? Can't be real. For an alien gui toolkit with no gadgets? And it comes from the ones who repeat every days funny stories about DaRaelChacha?

And that guy is working on a real stuff and he is described as he was the grinch, stoling the modern one from the poor guys.

How many "repeats". Yeahh. Sometime I must repeat to myself "This is still funny". It could be. If people stopped being teen rock and roll fanboys.

-- alfonso

Of course, being the aforementioned gugu, resident whiner of
#amigaita, I quote and subscribe the whole post from alfie.

Using MorphOS should be about fun. Reading these kind of threads on
MorphZone is not funny at all. Because I thought the average MorphOS
user was a bit more sane than the average computer user. But when you
read so many people showing little to no uderstanding of simple
technical iussues, and differences between implementations, it's
demotivating. Even more when you see that many people falling for easy
and not even well thought propaganda.

That's not to belittle the OWB effort: but in order to be a fully
fledged browser with the basic features (I.e.: at least cut'n'paste of
URLs, and the likes) integrated with the host environment it needs
just as much work as marcik faced when he *started* the Sputnik
project... And therefore developers knowing the host enviroment pretti
nicely.

Hopefully we'll just get a bit smarter with the new year, and possibly
we'll have fun again.

Kind regards,
Andrea

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Who cares of this unknown morphos whiner?

Judging from various comments now I feel that the majority of us morphers are nothing than eliteists, not open minded, and not open to external world...

They are just like as ducks in their little lake with no option to explore around and no wish to fly around and find new lakes, with better waters, or more food.

No any chance to see them analyze with serious mind the news...

They just laugh at any news because they have no enough braincells...

Well contine being so...

I choosed MorphOS because i wanted freah air than being stuck with AmigaOS 4.0, and I found it, but too many times I found that people here are crystallizing in a perpetual standstill...

Have you noticed that best advancements into Amiga world since one year and a half are coming from AmigaOS side and not anymore from MorphOS side? This fact now it is becaming oppressive.

Where are announcements of something new into MorphOS?

I want to fly higher and be open minded and open to the world, to new ideas and new programs to make my life better.

Maybe OWB could be not a valid solution for us all...

But this behaviour of criticizing all software coming from OS4.0 and threaten all news coming from OS4.0 as sort of ridicolous thingies and always making humor upon that, it is becaming sort of standard clich? here on Morphzone...

And it is not a good thing, it is just acting as sort of racist ku-klux-klan club for blue side only.

Well... I will continue staying here because I love Morphos, but I also like to evolve and to see evolving the OS I choosen...

And I will ALWAYS post new threads about new software from AOS 4.0, if I think it deserves to be noted here on MorphZone and being evidenced to all morphos users.

Fell free to make some humor upon it.

Feel free to leave or ignore me. I will not stay silent.

It is not me who deserve to leave this forum, it is the closed minded people that sooner or lesser will leave.

Closed minded people and humorists...

Bah... Bunch of poor sobbing creatures! Who cares them!

Quote:

There is time you can joke and there is time you must be serious. If you are talking about me, I am a professional humorist. Please a little respect for the jobs of the others. Have I ever teached you how to do your job? Have I ever told you how to paint pink puppets? No! So, don't teach me how to be an humorist!

-- alfonso

@Raf

if you were really open-minded, maybe you would discuss the valid arguments we gave instead of just being pissed off and insulting everyone?

I don't see why we should refrain from criticizing some choices (OWB, Cygnix, whatever...) just because it comes from OS4. I know there are very few developers left now, but is it a reason to accept low standards without even discussing them? Have your expectations got that low? That attitude is actually the one you despise : "don't look around, accept everything and shut up.". So, be an "amiga" citizen and don't fall to easy propaganda.