I am looking at my G5 since my PowerBook recently died, i am wondering about how you install or update the system if i use a non OF card like the X1950 Pro, usually i would just burn a disc but doesn't seem possible with such a card.

[ Edited by ChrisC 01.03.2025 - 16:57 ]

if it's a G5 pcie, you can leave your GeForce (Mac) into and put X1950Pro on another port... easy to update with USB key for example. it's my configuration here.

Yes, it is a PCI-E, forgot to mention that bit. So stick the old Nvidia 6600 card in the lower slot, 1950 Pro in the top slot (X16), then i will still get OF but when MOS starts i will be on the X1950 Pro?

MorphOS ignores the NVidia, while OF ignores the (non PPC-OF) Radeon.

The whole problem is that without having a OF compatible card the G5 will ignore pressing "c" to boot from CD, hence you need that NVidia (even if has no display connected) to boot from anything but the default HD partition.

These were my thoughts, i thought i would just ask here before i start anything so i am not starting off on the wrong idea. Thanks!

All went without a hitch bar SSDs are just not undetected (G5 issue), runs dead fast on a spinner so i won't bother with one.

I put the 6600 in second slot and x1950pro in lowest slot. IIRC I was told MOS cannot see a card in any other slot.

> I put the 6600 in second slot and x1950pro in lowest slot.
> IIRC I was told MOS cannot see a card in any other slot.

Yes, put the Radeon card in slot #1 (lowest one, x16) and the Nvidia card in slot #3 (2nd from top, x8), as #2 and #4 are only x4.

Yea, that is what i did, no idea why i typed it the wrong way round.

> no idea why i typed it the wrong way round.

As far as I can see, you typed nothing wrong. I just wanted to confirm your approach and add the reason for leaving the slot between the two cards empty :-)

I recently got a PowerMac G5 PCIe model A1117, 2.0GHz Dual-Core which is maxed out with 16GB RAM, and has it's original NVIDIA 6600 LE GFX card in it. I know it boots to Mac OSX Leopard as I have tested this.

I expected that I would just need to move the NVIDIA GFX card to the #3 slot (2 up from where it was in the bottom slot (#1) with just 1 free slot above it (#4). Then place a compatible PCIe GFX card into slot #1 (where the NVIDIA card was moved from) and the machine with a MorphOSBoot CD in the DVD drive tray and boot the machine holding the "C" key down for it to recognise the boot CD and allow me to format a hard drive to SFS to install MorphOS onto it. I have a X600 Radeon PCIe 256MB GFX card (PC version - 99-JC49-1A-NE) that I hoped to accomplish this with, as that chipset is in the GFX chip in the PCIe iMac (A1145) that I have.

My available screen, currently, is only 17inch and VGA capable, but I have a DVI-VGA dongle to handle this, but I get no sign that the machine is booting correctly, no chime, or anything on screen to show that the PowerMac is booting from the CD, just the fans going hi-speed after about 30-45 seconds. This screen displays the MacOSX Leopard boot-process and main screen using the same hardware/dongle without any issues.

Is there some parameter that I forgot to do, or could maybe the Radeon PCIe card be faulty and maybe I should try a different GFX card? This website shows the same model of card that I am referring to, as reference Radeon X600 256MB V/D/VO 99-JC49-1A-NE

Radeon card needs to either have a PPC OF which is pretty rare as PCIe and would negate the need for the NVidia card.
Or AtomBIOS which came out later.

Your X600 falls into neither category.

What you want is something RadeonHDxxxx (look here ).
You may also want to double check with what is supported in the last tinygl beta.


Also, try booting by holding "Alt" as "C" might fail.

[ Edited by Kronos 20.03.2025 - 08:04 ]

Quote:

That is quite clear. But it leads me to one question, however: How is it possible that the same X600 (AKA "Radeon 9600 PCIe edition") is supported in iMac G5?

I don't see where the question is.

The GPU in an iMac surely comes with a BIOS compatible with the OpenFirmware used in that iMac.

Find a suitable PPC-OF image for that PCIe card and it will work just fine. Finding one that is a 100% fit might be an issue.
Hence just getting an AtomBIOS card (or one of the few genuine G5_PCIe_Radeon cards) is the better option.

Quote:

You're obviously and painfully right.

So theoretically it would be possible tu dump the compatible ROM from iMac G5 X600 and flash the NewSense's PC BIOS card with it.

Of course there are numerous issues that might arise (first one that comes to my mind would be the capacity of the ROM chip on PC version of this card). From what I remember the Radeon 9600 was also quite a hit-and-miss when it comes to successful flashing the AGP versions. But it doesn't hurt to try, right?

Quote:So, which Radeon PPC PCIe G5 PPC cards are there to choose/find that will work straight out-of-the-box (OOTB), even if it doesn't come with a box ?
Quote:I know that the Radeon X1950 card is very popular for this model of PowerMac G5 (A1117/A1177) but that card is not a RadeonHDxxxx card anyway, so what makes that work even though it's not an HD model Radeon GFX card?

Also, the same goes for the other cards in the "X" list ... X600 XT (R380), X800 XT / Pro (R420), X1300 or Pro, X1550, X1600 or Pro, X1800, X1900 GT, X1950 XT or Pro, or FireGL X3 (R420) - what makes those work in the PCIe G5 PowerMacs or are some/all of them also AGP card variants as well?

Also, how many Radeon HDxxxx cards have been tested in these systems as it seems it might be almost hit or miss if you get a card that will work, and I don't want to end up buying cards that don't work time after time and get nowhere, as that then would make these cards and this project more costly.
Quote:I'll do that, thanks for mentioning that.
Quote:OK I'll probably try both keys to see what does and doesn't work - once I find a GFX card that has an Atom BIOS in it, ...

by the way ... how do I do that, check that it has an Atom BIOS, as I can't see which chip on such a board is the Atom BIOS, and handily this feature does not seem to be specified in any of the card specs that I've checked through so far, or are ALL the HD models Atom BIOS based?

Quote:
Quote:That's a great idea, if only I was capable of carrying out such a procedure, and had the hardware and software to be able to do so!

However, I would try to do that if I got sufficient guidance as to how to accomplish that.
Quote:@ Kronos and Koszer - thanks for your replies so far, much appreciated.

If I knew how to flash the BIOS on the PC card, or got the required guidance, etc., then I'd try that as surely using an Apple PPC BIOS would be preferable as then I could use the Radeon to gain access to Open Firmware as well, and would not need the NVIDIA in the system at all, which might also liberate others from this need to keep their NVIDIA card in their system, and more of us would have access to and the ability to amend the OF much more easily!

Quote:

Well, there's an old article about flashing PC cards for MorphOS use here.

A few downsides:
1. It's old (refering to flashing AGP cards, but the principle is the same)
2. It's in Polish (but online translators should do the job).

As for dumping the Mac ROM - you'd need an OSX tool for that. I believe there is one out there but I don't recall its name.

> What you want is something RadeonHDxxxx [...]. You may also want
> to double check with what is supported in the last tinygl beta.

What he actually wants is more like Radeon X1300 to X1950, especially after checking what's supported in the latest (i.e. tenth) TinyGL beta (as opposed to the one before that).

> which Radeon PPC PCIe G5 PPC cards are there to
> choose/find that will work straight out-of-the-box [...]?

Just the Radeon X1900 GT G5 Mac Edition (at times also sold without the 'GT' part of the name), really.

>> What you want is something RadeonHDxxxx

> I know that the Radeon X1950 card is very popular for
> this model of PowerMac G5 [...], so what makes that work
> even though it's not an HD model Radeon GFX card?

It works because it's supported by MorphOS, and better than anything Radeon HD, especially in terms of 3D.

> X600 XT (R380), X800 XT / Pro (R420), X1300 or Pro, X1550,
> X1600 or Pro, X1800, X1900 GT, X1950 XT or Pro, or FireGL X3
> (R420) - what makes those work in the PCIe G5 PowerMacs or
> are some/all of them also AGP card variants as well?

You need R5xx-based GPU for compatible AtomBIOS version, so X1300 to X1950. R3xx/R4xx-based ones work in AGP Macs (AGP cards with PPC ROM) or in Sam460/X5000 (PCIe cards with x86 ROM).

> how many Radeon HDxxxx cards have been tested in these
> systems as it seems it might be almost hit or miss

I have counted 5 different Radeon HD cards (#8) reported working. Note that going by the model number isn't safe as of two cards of the same model number, one might work while the other does not.

> how do I [...] check that it has an Atom BIOS [...],
> or are ALL the HD models Atom BIOS based?

Radeon cards of models X1300 and up (= R5xx GPU series and up) for x86/x64 Windows/Linux PCs (so not those for PPC/x86/x64 Macs) have AtomBIOS. This includes all Radeon HD models. Strictly speaking, also R4xx-based cards for x86/x64 Windows/Linux PCs have AtomBIOS, but that version of AtomBIOS is too old for MorphOS' AtomBIOS parser.

@ Andreas_Wolf - thanks for imparting your knowledge of the vagaries of the PCIe GFX cards for use with the A1117/A1177 models of PowerMac G5 (PCIe) models. I will try to obtain a more (actually) compatible GFX card for my hardware and report back on the success, and/or failures that I have as all this knowledge is likely to be useful to others who purchase such hardware, to ensure the easiest way of finding the best solution to get it up and running with the minimum of trouble.

Quote:

The easiest way ATM is to go and buy a supported X1950 card. Here are the photos of some cards tested by zukow. There are a few X1950's there. The one "with boobs" is reported to work well. I've tested another two "with boobs". They seem to work fine.