At least according to this article. I guess Genesi can still try to win Linux market then. )

well... the guy is kinda disappointed by the mac mini running Linux... ok i can understand why... but the Pegasos doesn't do better (Pegasos I). The Peg 2 may do a bit better, but not much.




[ Edited by SoundSquare on 2005/1/24 15:29 ]

well ... the pegII is much slower on linux. And there is no OpenGL support either...

Well.. Pega2 could be quite competetive concerning it having a lot faster Hard disk (MacMini uses 2.5Inch 40G Laptop drive) and more memory.

And.. Imho, there is no technical reason for not to use faster CPU on Pegasos.. If one is willing to accept more noise and heat.

What I really didn't like, is that in many reviews saying that the noice of that thing sometimes is disturbing! So not a really Cool computing for the MiniMac... too bad

[ Edited by liquidbit on 2005/1/24 17:44 ]

a) slower than ?

b) no OpenGL ? Of coz GL works fine on Pegasos 1 && 2. Not with all cards of coz because lack of ATI/NVIDIA/etc support but, it works fine in all cards supported by XF86 or Xorg in 3D.

The mini desperately needs one of these:

http://www.hgst.com/hdd/travel/tr7k60.htm

Of course this further pushes the price of the mini up and then you have a spare drive to give away ($149 was cheapest I could find)

Chances are for desktop use you should really buy the E version - rated for higher, longer duty cycle.

[ Edited by JKD on 2005/1/24 9:54 ]

Quote:

@liquidbit:

I haven't seen any reviews saying it is noisy. The one that is the subject of this thread didn't even say that. The author there says among other things he thought it would be quiet, but then he doesn't tell us whther it was. There are other reviews, like this one, that say it is quiet.

I don't know, myself. I am anxious to hear whether it is quiet and low wattage and reliable and so on.

@Velcro:

Actually, hi did.

Liquid bit

I think you have your 'facts' backwards. Its the MAC that doesnt have Opengl support in LInux AFAIK.

My peg2 with Radeon 7500 gets about 450/fps with glxgears. I play opengGl games and screenblankers np.

FYI: When we were at the Freescale labs our ODW was outperforming a DUAL G5 mac with YDL running Open Gl! The mac does not support HW 3d in linux afaik.

magnetic

Magnetic:

Why is that? Shouldn't Linux not care what the maschine is, but only what the gfx card is? Putting the same supported gfx card into Peg and Mac leads to different results? Sounds a bit strange in my ears...

[QUOTE]
Shouldn't Linux not care what the maschine is, but only what the gfx card is?
[/QUOTE]

Don't know if that's the source of the problem, but MAC gfx cards use a different bios/firmware then their PC counterparts.

Pegasos supports the PC versions of the cards AFAIK.

Of course it sounds strange. ITs shocking. If you know about PPC linux you would know that ATI and others do not release drivers. 3d support is difficult. Maybe it does have something to do with the cards being pc cards... but not sure.

I witnessed it with my own eyes and I dont make up stories... ask Sven Luther he was there.

magnetic

1. I can't really believe that a 1,42 GHz G4 with for example YDL 4.0 is slower than my Peggy II G3/600 MHz.

2. The main reason to run Linux on the Pegasos is to start MoL, or to use Linux for necessary every day software like office-software, internet browser which is less comfortable on Morphos. On an iMac it is not necessary to start Linux first if you want to have MacOS X. I don't see the advantage of Linux compared to MacOS X (on a Macintosh, on a PC there is a big difference between Windows and Linux, of course). If I want a cheap and powerful Linux-computer, I buy a PC.

Well to be back on topic,

The whole point of the Pegasos is that its OPEN. Open Firware, Open Source OSs. Thats the whole deal with the ODW. This is what seperates it in the PPC industry from the Apple machines which are closed and will stay that way.

magnetic

BTW Debian PPC linux with 2.6.x kernel on my g4 peg2 runs great and is comprable in speed to an x86 2ghz+ running linux imo

Quote:

What? MorphOS has no webbrowser. How is that better then, let say, Firefox?

Quote:

The point is, not everyone like to have another boring and noisy x86. I could have few Dual-x86 at work, to do some important work, but I home I need quiet computer, that runs Linux. Pegasos fits here without a problem. People not always tend to go for price/CPU cycles.

Plus, I like MorphOS, too.

The only killer for Pegasos is Genesi...

Sigh! When will you people get it and stop crapping in your own shoes?

Without Genesi it seems likely the Peg would have been nothing but a memory - go pick up a clue and calculate the cost impact of the following:

1. Developing a product
2. Not shipping said product in volume for a year due to chip problems
3. Debugging and developing a fix for said chip
4. Re-calling boards and fixing
5. Improving the fix for said product
6. Implementing the fix on all remaining product, including some recalls.

Without Genesi, bplan might have gone the way of Phase5 due to cost of above.

Genesi continues to sell Pegasos into the marketplace, finding and negotiating ongoing business deals above and beyond the stalled market of Amiga and ex-Amiga users.

I have no interest to debate this but if you wish to continue then please PM me!



[ Edited by JKD on 2005/1/25 13:49 ]

Quote:

Indeed. The Pegasos can use exactly the same CPU's (even dual CPU's, it's only a matter of releasing them ). Gigabit ethernet and digital audio out. And it is more expandable with it's AGP slot and three PCI slots, which makes it possible to configure it pretty much any way you like! SCSI, RAID, USB2, etc, etc, it's up to you.

And now with the price drop it's an even better deal! $999 USD for a complete ODW system (without monitor), of which $100 USD is earmarked to support the Gentoo foundation, so it's actually $899+$100 for a good cause!

Hmm, the dollar is cheap in Europe ...!

Quote:

Umm...my 1999 Mac is Open Firmware and the OS's other than MacOS are Open Source. MorphOS is closed as well as MacOS so I really don't see the advantage one way or the other.

Look at this Open Firmware Site and you'll see that the Pegasos is not specifically listed as an Open Firmware machine - but falls under option 4. Notice that Mac PPC machines are first on the list. The latest Gentoo newsletter talks both of the ODW and the Mini Mac.


[ Edited by DSLCC on 2005/1/25 20:13 ]

[ Edited by DSLCC on 2005/1/25 20:47 ]

DSLCC: Site you linked is made by someone individual mac-user and it contains considerable errors in it.. Not to mention obvuous that it's not been updated in well over a year.

Quote:

Granted...that site was old. Here's a newer one.Open Firmware Home Page. The fact is that the Mac is an Open Firmware machine as well as the Pegasos. It is inaccurate to say that the Mac is Closed. It is inaccurate to say that MorphOS is Open. That is my only point. I'm not saying that the Mac is a better platform than the G4 PegII...just that it is inaccurate to say the Pegasos is Open and the Mac is closed.

Is MorphZone an open source community web-site?

[ Edited by DSLCC on 2005/1/25 21:00 ]

[ Edited by DSLCC on 2005/1/25 21:04 ]

I dunno why anyone would complain about the power supply being 'huge'
it looks to be about the size of a factory A1200 supply-considerably
smaller than the A500 brick. In other words, some people would
complain if they were hung with a new rope..

I want a Mac Mini

DSLCC

Hi

1. Thank you for changing your avatar!

2. I never said MOS was open... of course it is not - though Ambient now is!

3. As a company (i'm speaking industrial market on this thread not consumer) you have more acess to the Pegasos hardware than you do the Mac. Its possible to obtain good developer documentation..

magnetic

Quote:
Hi!

Quote:

You're welcome! :)

Quote:

One step at a time. :)
Quote:

Agreed - see how simple that was? :) The real problems though is from companies like ATI, etc not giving up dev info. Under your definition the most closed platform I can think of is Eyetech's board.

The x86 hardware should be the most open hardware, but it isn't because of third party companies not giving up dev info.