Is it possible to force the drivers for the Symbios controller to function after booting from an ATA harddrive?

SCSI doesnt work (yet?).

However u can put the boot.img on a usb key, booting from it.
It do it and it works fine. Safes you from the requirement booting of expensive Mac Cards and
also lets you keep your exsisting harddisk as RDB layout.

I don't want to boot from it,. I'd just like to be able to use it like I already can under Ubuntu.
Any other ideas?

As far as I am aware SCSI & SATA pci cards don't work on Powermac G4 with Morphos 2.6 so all you can do is wait and hope the problem is fixed in a future update.

Quote:

Could you elaborate?
I've not heard anything about this on either Morphzone or the mailing list (aside from DanicaTalos' postings regarding problems with a particular (possibly unsupported) SATA card).

From Golem's comment it appears that the scsi drivers are part of the boot image. Consequently, I would have thought that HDconfig would automatically pick up any drives attached to supported controllers, and Mount could be used to configure the desired (auto)mounting behaviour. As I don't have a supported scsi controller (except on my Cyberstorm mk3), I unfortunately cannot check this though.

Regards



Rich

[ Edited by boot_wb on 2010/10/20 14:50 ]

@boot_wb

My source is IRC conversations on the subject. SCSI and SATA cards were said to not be working. I asked cyfm/Pega-1 to confirm the lack of working SATA on Powermac myself, which he did.

@Ruud

Ah, thanks for that. Never have got to grips with IRC...

Twitter, Facebook, Morphzone, E-mail & mailing lists I can handle - IRC is one of my last web2.0 blind spots I suppose.

Regards



Rich

> IRC is one of my last web2.0 blind spots I suppose.

Web 2.0? Internet Relay Chat is not part of and was there before the "World Wide Web" :-)

Quote:

.. and I can confirm it here again.

Quote:

The Symbios controller in question, while designed for a PC, boots in a Pegasos due to firmware. However, tbhis same controlller will work in a Powermac under Ubuntu after the system is booted vis and standard ATA drive (the SCSI drive is not bootable).


When I first brought up this question , Golem responded.:


<Quote:>


Jim wrote:
Again, the question is, why can't I do the same (as I can under Ubuntu) under MorphOS (once released) - boot from an ATA drive and use the SCSI drives as secondary storage?

Who said said you can't do that?<Quote>

. I don't believe his message to me indicated that the driver was part of the boot image. I do believe Pegasos firmware has a component that allows it to recognize the Symbios cards;' BIOS enabling the Pegasos to boot from an SCSI drive, but the drive to run the card still ought to br a seperate component..

Perhaps we need Golem or someone else from the development team to weigh in on this. So far, the responses posted haven't been that usefyl, nor have they convinced me that this can't be done.

In fact, except for booting, SCSI and SATA controllers should work (once the system isd booted from an ATA drive). Even if there is code to boot Pegs from these controllers, there still has to ber a driver present while to system is running to operate them.

@Jim
Just in case you missed it the first time :)

SCSI & SATA cards DO NOT currently work on Powermac G4 under MorphOS

Pega-1 has confirmed this and he is one of the most senior members of the MorphOS development team. It seems support for them is likely to follow at a later date.

While the SCSI driver included in the Pegasos2 boot.img isn't included at all for Mac (because it doesn't work), the SATA SiI3x12 one is included but doesn't work, either.
it's non-functional without further modification/fixes, it's as simple as that ...

I APPRECIATE THE CAPITAL LETTERS RUDD, BUT PEGA-1'S STATEMENT RUNS
CONTRARY TO GOLEM'S.

BTW - Full capitialization is the internet equivalent of yelling. Should I be pronouncing Ruud as Rude?

Pega-1, thank you for clarifying that the Symbios controllers driver is included in the boot image.
That would explain why Unbubtu can handle this controller on a Powermac while MorphOS can't. Is there any posdsibility that the driver could be seperated (from the boot image) to allow its use on a Powermac.

While I am impressed with SATA controllers, the boost from an SATA1 controller will not be that significant and I am already using the Symbios controller under Ubuntu. All I would have to do to add an SCSI drive for MorphOS (if there wasadriver) is add a second drive. I wouldn't mind a 15,000 rpm external drive on my system.]

In fact, I can add one now., but I'd only be able to run iit under Ubuntu. As I'm considering making MorphOS my sole Operating System, this added functionality would be great (and a stand alone driver would not be that hard to create as you already have most of the necessary code incorporated into the Pegasos boot image).

BTW - I really getting a kick out of 2.6. The Powermac is a nice improvement over my former eMac. No bugs found yet either. Great stuff. Thanks.

[ Edited by Jim on 2010/10/20 18:07 ]

@Jim

No problem, and I understand exactly to what you are referring.
I thought (mistakenly) that perhaps the drives were just not showing up on the Ambient desktop, but may perhaps have been available to you under 'mounter'.

Having searched for the scsi driver myself (and obviously not found it as a separate file) I merely thought to point out to you that it was part of the boot.img (although I was obviously mistaken about that too in this particular case) to save you fruitlessly searching for a non-existent file.

Regards



Rich

> I APPRECIATE THE CAPITAL LETTERS RUDD

Huh? You're the first one in this thread using full capitalization.

> PEGA-1'S STATEMENT RUNS CONTRARY TO GOLEM'S.

Since only one of them two is a MorphOS Team member I'd know whose statement to take for real ;-)

> Pega-1, thank you for clarifying that the Symbios controllers driver
> is included in the boot image

...for the Pegasos, but not in the Mac's boot image.

I really don't understand your interjection into this Andreas. Sure Rude's statement wasn't all capital letters. but it was also bold faced and he assumed I somehow missed a point when what I need was clarifucation (which I got from Pega-1).

The only question I now have is wouldn't it be easy to reuse the code in the Pegasos boot image to create a stand Alone SCSI driver for the other systems?

Quote:

Yes you could pronounce Ruud as Rude. I do and my friends do, it's a common way to pronounce Ruud in the UK.
Yes i'm well aware that capitialisation is considered "yelling" that's why, acronyms aside only two words were in capitals. I admit bold was a bit over the top. My apologies.
As for contrary statements: afaik Golem is not on the development team whereas Pega-1 certainly is. So who's statement has the greater relevance?





[ Edited by Ruud on 2010/10/20 18:54 ]

> I really don't understand your interjection into this Andreas.

Sorry, I didn't notice the fully capitalized "DO NOT". My bad.

> wouldn't it be easy to reuse the code in the Pegasos boot image
> to create a stand Alone SCSI driver for the other systems?

I'd say yes, it would. But then I'm just an end user and have no more insight than any other non-member of the MorphOS Team or betatesting team :-)

No, actually I'm the one who should be appologizing here. I wouldn't want to offend either you or Andreas.
And of course I'd always consider a statement by Pega-1 as the final word on a subject.
I knew once I booted my Powermac and installed 2.6 that the SCSI driver had to be incorporated in a manner that was different from Linux.

Still without much revision, the developers could give us a stand alone driver.

I can only make a request as the deverloper do as they choose. But as P:egasos users migrate to Powermacs, there may be a few that would like to retain this controller even if it can't be booted from. Even as a secondary controller, it provides access to some fast hard drives.

If I get a chance I'll try to run some benchmarks under Linux comparing to two controllers.

Anyway, thank you all for helping to clarify the issue at hand. Now that I know there's nothing I can do, all I can do is hope that one of the developers has the time to im plement my request.

Take care all!

BTW- Isn't 2.6 really cool!. I love being able to add USB and Sound cards!
I heard someone gripping about the limited number of USB ports on a Powermac. Heck, I've got the two original ports, four more extenal 2.0 ports, and one internal port.

Best MOS revision yet!!

I'd love to read some more clarifications about these SCSI controllers not working on macs, while they worked on Pegasos.

Why were the drivers embedded in the boot file? I guess that would be to allow for booting from SCSI drives. But why a driver is required, if the firmware already allows reading from SCSI drives? I guess MorphOS boot procedure says bye bye to the firmware very soonish...

And why exactly they don't work on macs, is the same SCSI card unaccesible when plugged into this different computer?

I guess I'd have to leard about MorphOS' components to access PCI devices...

@Jim
As the developer pega-1 said, It' not supported at the moment controller SYMBIOS SCSI PCI and SATA PCI in PowerMac G4 in MorphOS2.6, while They are usable in Pegasos I/II in MorphOS2.6.
(if inserted a SYMBIOS SCSI in PowerMac It's not seen as device supported, while if inserted a SiI3512 It stops the bootstrap of the O.S.)

In MorphOS2.6 in Pegasos2, I have found useful the Symbios 895 card for connect a SCSI scanner to be used for exemple with SCANdal (or Scanquix), but my opinion is It's not 100% ok the driver in this system (Pegasos2), my idea It's there is some to fix, so I don't think It' s a very good idea to use at the moment HD SCSI for the MorphOS System, better use the PATA inside.
(not good experience with SYMBIOS 875, many problems, It was "not usable" as card, but It's possibile this card has some problems, I don't know)

In MorphOS2.6 (and AmigaOS4.1.2) in Pegasos2, I have also used a SiI3512 PCI with connected a SATA HD and also my opinion is It's not 100% ok the driver; some devalidate or sometimes kernel not bootstrap and other problems, in MorphOS2.6 and also in AmigaOS4.1.2.
(while this card SATA is not so useful for PowerMac FW800 and MDD with PATA100, It could be very useful for older Powermac with ATA66, so you could have a better I/O)

So my idea It's that is good It's not supported at the moment these two controllers in MorphOS2.6 for PowerMac, so the MorphOs team has time to fix

regards


[ Edited by Divinity on 2010/10/21 10:39 ]

Hi,

I've got a Sil3512 in my MDD, and the harddrive connected to it is not even recognized. Is there something I sould have done to make it work?
BR

> Is there something I sould have done [...]?

Yes, read what pega-1 wrote in this very thread ;-)

Yes, everyone, I fully understand why the SCSI controllers won't work inder MorphOS (as the driver is only located in the Pegasos bootfile).

But it still find it frustrating that these same controller cards will work under Linux in a Powermac (their not bootable. but since the driver is not part of the bootfile the will run correctly once the system is booted from an ATA drive).. Sorry to repeat that again.

There's no reason a non-bootable SCSI driver couldn't be created to give Powermacs running MorphOS the same capability that Powermacs running Linux have.

Quote:

That wouldn't have made it work ;-p