Hey guys,

As stated, while I'm no stranger to alternative operating systems, I've recently installed MorphOS 3.2 and I have to say I'm struggling to get Quake III running.

My system is as follows:

Apple Powermac G4 AGP w/gigabit ethernet, 2 x 500mhz PPC, Radeon 7500 mac edition, Soundblaster Live!, Chrysalis pack, 1280 x 1024 17" display.

I downloaded the patch files from here (Quake III):

http://morphos-files.net/find.php?find=quake

I placed my Quake III disc in the CDROM drive and applied the patch, the patch appeared to read the disc and install fine. However, upon double clicking the Quake III icon I receive the following error:

Grab_zpscc89823f.png

What am I doing missing here? I just cannot work it out.

Any advice would really be appreciated as I'm eager for some Quake III goodness.

tinygl.library was rewritten for MorphOS 3.x. At the moment, it only supports r200 and r300 hardware.
So Radeon 7x00 are not supported by current MorphOS' GL.

You can try to either:
- install an older MorphOS 2.x version
- copy MOSSYS:Libs/tinygl.library (and no other file!) from an older MorphOS version

> At the moment, it only supports r200 and r300 hardware. So Radeon 7x00 are
> not supported by current MorphOS' GL.

Just to add:

https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=9252&forum=11&start=4

So it should work again with MorphOS 3.3.

Edit: Scrap that. See follow-up by Henes. Sorry for confusion.

[ Edited by Andreas_Wolf 25.07.2013 - 21:52 ]

Sorry but no it will not.
The specific message you linked is in a thread about the r100 2D driver.
There is no GL driver for r100 in the making.

> Sorry but no it will not. The specific message you linked is in a thread about the r100 2D driver.
> There is no GL driver for r100 in the making.

Ah, I see. Thanks for correcting me.

I see, at least I know I'm not crazy, I just couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong.

So just to clarify, if my particular 7500 (R200) card going to be supported in the next morphOS release?

Also, I don't suppose you have any instructions regarding copying the MOSSYS:Libs/tinygl.library from an older version of MorphOS?

Thanks for your time guys.

> So just to clarify, if my particular 7500 (R200) card going to be supported in the
> next morphOS release?

See Henes' answer. Note that Radeon 7500 has RV200 (not R200), which confusingly enough belongs to the R100 family.

> I don't suppose you have any instructions regarding copying the MOSSYS:Libs/tinygl.library
> from an older version of MorphOS?

Download http://www.morphos-team.net/morphos-2.7.iso and mount it. Then simply do as Henes suggested.

Downloading as we speak, thanks for the help guys.

Just as a point, and not trying to nitpick here, but it may be benificial to users like myself to make it clear that R100 7x00 series ATi cards aren't fully supported in the latest version of MorphOS on the MorphOS hardware requirements page so that people like myself don't go out any buy such cards expecting them to be supported - Luckily, as can be expected, the card was cheap as chips and there is a workaround so it's a case of no harm done.

Once again, cheers for the help and prompt responses.

That worked a treat guys, thank you very much for your help, now I feel like registering my OS ;)

> it may be benificial to users like myself to make it clear that R100 7x00 series ATi cards aren't
> fully supported in the latest version of MorphOS on the MorphOS hardware requirements page

Fully agreed. Radeon 7x00 should either be moved to the "Without 3d hardware acceleration" section or should get a note clarifying the need of MorphOS 2.x tinygl.library (and maybe the restriction to Rave3D/Goa/Warp3D with MorphOS 3.x tinygl.library).

But Radeon 7x00 are supported with "3d hardware acceleration". For Warp3D stuff :)

Better get a Radeon 8500 or 9000 PRO.

>> Radeon 7x00 should [...] get a note clarifying the need of MorphOS 2.x tinygl.library
>> (and maybe the restriction to Rave3D/Goa/Warp3D with MorphOS 3.x tinygl.library).

> But Radeon 7x00 are supported with "3d hardware acceleration". For Warp3D stuff :)

Yes, that's why I said a note about that restriction to "warp3d crap stuff" would be useful :-)


Edit: Note has been added meanwhile in the form an own category.

[ Edited by Andreas_Wolf 08.10.2013 - 23:29 ]

Quote:

I've got my eye open for one - It's such a shame that the second a Radeon is labeled a mac edition the price doubles on ebay.

The issue is, ATM I'm running the time released demo of MorphOS, I like this OS and I want to use it to breathe life back into this particular G4 that has come into my posession as there is a bit of a story behind it, but at the same time I want to make sure I can get the OS doing everything I want correctly without crashing before I go spending hundreds on a full version of the OS and new graphics cards such as a 9800 - And that's made a little difficult when you purchace hardware only to find that it isn't as fully supported as you first thought it was. However, I totally understand that the developers of MorphOS have lives away from the development of their operating system.

I've got Quake III running and I can get into a game, however it crashes shortly after with cycling audio, any ideas?

Ok, I've really tried with this OS. I've installed Quake III and patched it correctly, I can navigate the menu's just fine, go to start a game and it just crashes. I've installed Homeworld, applied the correct patch, I can once again navigate the menu's, go to start a game and it just crashes.

As far as I can tell it's an issue with the drivers as it only seems to be tinygl that's affected, everything else runs fine - And I'd say that it's due to the fact that driver support has been unknowingly dropped for R100 hardware!

I want to give this OS a fair go, but I'm not going to go out and shell out upwards of $100.00 for a graphics card 'and then' shell out even more cash for an unrestricted version of the OS itself unless I can be certain that it will work 100% and do what I want it to do - And in order to do that I need it to work 100% on the cheap 7500 I bought specifically for this purpose!

The 30 minute restriction is frustratingly a little too restrictive - At least allow an hour, if I have a package that could quite possibly take over half an hour to install there's no way I can trial it.

I understand that this OS was developed my Amiga enthusiasts for Amiga enthusiasts, but honestly, if you want it to grow, if you want it to develop into something bigger you're going to struggle if you expect people to pay for a fairly restricted OS with limited hardware support (or any support for that matter, search the forums for an issue that users have to have come across before and it's like it never existed in the first place!) when you can download Ubuntu for free, download Steam, install games and be playing within two hours.

I'm no stranger to alternative OS's and I've used AmigaOS before, but there is no way I can justify shelling out more money for this OS with my experience thus far, no way.

madCrow,
Quote:

I've bought two Apple Radeon 9000Pro cards from this guy.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/APPLE-POWERMAC-G4-ATI-RADEON-9000-AGP-603-1989-ADC-DVI-VIDEO-CARD-630-4481-/300937886762?pt=PCC_Video_TV_Cards&hash=item46114bbc2a

$15 with shipping. He only sells to the US and Canada though. I can probably get one to you.

> I'm not going to go out and shell out upwards of $100.00 for a graphics card 'and then'
> shell out even more cash for an unrestricted version of the OS itself unless I can be
> certain that it will work 100% and do what I want it to do - And in order to do that I need
> it to work 100% on the cheap 7500 I bought specifically for this purpose!

Do I get this right that you are willing to buy another graphics card as soon as your Radeon 7500 is fully supported?

> search the forums for an issue that users have to have come across before and it's
> like it never existed in the first place!

I don't quite understand. Can you elaborate some more on this?

The story goes like this:

I was going through a salvage shop at the local rubbish tip when I spotted a sad looking Powermac G4 hiding under one of the shelves, I pulled it out, checked it over and it had potential so I brought it home thinking I could possibly make use of it. Upon bringing it home I powered it up and surprisingly it powered up just fine. It had both OS9 and OSX installed on it as well as a magnitude of graphic design software, emails, personal pictures and even bank statements! Which I thought was quite odd, who the hell throws out a PC with so much information still on the HDD?

As the previous owners name was all over the machine I got curious and started Googling....

As it turns out the previous owner had passed away a few years ago, explaining the mass of information still on the HDD. Digging deeper, reading the messages on the machine and reading the obituary I couldn't help but get the impression that the previous owner had possibly passed away under his own hand - I started to feel sorry for this bloke...

Judging from the many messages on the machine it was obvious that this particular Mac was the previous owners pride and joy and he was an absolute Mac enthusiast - It didn't feel right to turn this PC into land fill, I felt I had to make something of it. As I had no OS discs a re-install of OS9 or OSX was off the cards and fairly pointless as Apple abandoned these Power PC beasts in a big way, there's simply no software available for them anymore, and the current OS installs were pretty fried.

So I started to think, what could I do with this thing? I'd plastic polished it all up and cleaned out the electronics, I needed to find a purpose for this machine.

And that's when it dawned on me, the last of the Amiga's ran PowerPC processors, due to the fact I've always been an Amiga enthusiast and a long time owner of an A500 could I install AmigaOS on this machine?

Sadly, the answer, as everyone here knows was that was never going to happen...

...And that's when I stumbled upon MorphOS, bingo, my little Mac had a purpose!

The OS installed without a hitch, I installed the Chrysalis pack and it looked a treat. It was equipped with a Rage128 Pro which just wasn't going to cut it from a 3D perspective so I needed to find a card that was supported by the OS in regards to 3D functionality while not costing the earth as I have no idea if this OS is going to work for me or not and unlike my fantastic Ubuntu machine this OS actually costs a reasonable sum of money (reasonable considering the cost of the hardware it's installed on) as everyone knows, the minute a Radeon is labeled as 'Mac Edition' it costs the earth. I came across a 7500, which the MorphOS website said supported full 3D functionality and I snapped it up.

Only to find that there had been changes to MorphOS 3.2 and R100 cards were no longer fully supported, this was after I'd been pulling my hair out trying to nut out what was wrong with my rig!

Now I'm in a situation where I have to spend more than I wanted to on a graphics card in the hope that I can get OpenGL games running right under TinyGL to play the two games that I was really hoping to get back into 'and then' shell out even more for the OS or just give up on this project entirely.

Honestly, the whole experience has just been a little frustrating and more than a little disappointing - Especially considering the things I'm able to achieve with my Ubuntu rig. It's a cheap E6600 based Dell Optiplex 745 with 3GB of ram, a 64GB SSD, an Nvidia 2GB GT610 graphics card (the cheapest one NV make!) and a 1440 x 900 Dell 19" widescreen monitor - All up the whole rig with Dell monitor, Dell keyboard and Logitech mouse owes me $110.00 and it plays Halflife 2, TF2, Killing Floor and many other games at 60fps+!

I was just really hoping to do something with this G4 for obvious reasons, quite possibly it isn't going to happen as I just can't justify the expense of a higher spec'd Radeon...

Quote:

Jim, can you PM me, that looks the goods, I may take you up on that offer.

Want so bad to get this beast running nicely.

Matt.

> I came across a 7500, which the MorphOS website said supported full 3D functionality
> and I snapped it up. Only to find that there had been changes to MorphOS 3.2 and
> R100 cards were no longer fully supported

I think this change came with MorphOS 3.0 and its new tinygl.library. But you're right that the non-support of R100 GPUs in the new TinyGL wasn't made clear anywhere public. At least I hadn't come across any mention of it since the release of MorphOS 3.0 more than a year ago. Only this thread made me aware of it.

Some error and/or the lack of time made the whole tinygl.library changes undocumented in 3.0...
As it took a lot of effort and several years to rewrite it from scratch for MorphOS 3.0, it's a bit sad...

And, actually, it was already discussed in the following thread that current tinygl only got drivers for r200 and r300 (nothing for r100, voodoo, permedia, sis and powervr): https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=9256&forum=49&start=4

Perhaps you can sell the Radeon 7500 on ebay.
Another option would be to install MorphOS-2.7, which is supporting the R100 cards.

>> the non-support of R100 GPUs in the new TinyGL wasn't made clear anywhere public.
>> At least I hadn't come across any mention of it since the release of MorphOS 3.0 more
>> than a year ago. Only this thread made me aware of it.

> actually, it was already discussed in the following thread that current tinygl only got
> drivers for r200 and r300 (nothing for r100, voodoo, permedia, sis and powervr):
> https://morph.zone/modules/newbb_plus/viewtopic.php?topic_id=9256&forum=49&start=4

Indeed. I somehow overlooked that your statement back then about the new TinyGL of MorphOS 3.0 was restricted to R200 and thus didn't include R100. So I want to correct myself and say that I actually came across a mention of this fact 2 months ago, not only now in this thread :-)